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Up Topic The Rybka Lounge / Computer Chess / Cluster vs FIDE Master at Rook-Odds
- - By Kkuo (**) Date 2010-02-10 06:31
How would this one go?  Has it ever happened (excluding the matches with Milov)?  What about queen-odds against a 2000 player?
Parent - By Uly (Gold) Date 2010-02-10 10:33

> How would this one go?


The GM would win them easily, a rook is too much, unless Vas added more components to Rybka so she is aware that she's a rook down and that she is playing a human, so she changes her playing style and play accordingly, but then it's not Rybka anymore.
Parent - - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) Date 2010-02-10 14:44
Considering that FM with knight odds demolishes Rybka 3 on an octacore, I think that FM with knight odds would still win against the cluster.  A FM with rook odds should have a clean score in a 6-game match against the cluster.
Parent - - By briggo (*) Date 2010-02-10 16:11
how about the cluster without book against FM?
Parent - By Highendman (****) Date 2010-02-10 18:11
No material odds, just no book vs. an unassisted human? Imho the cluster would wipe the floor with the FM. Or with a GM too.
If with some amazing luck the human lures the cluster into some very drawish theory line, he/she might draw a game or two max, in a 10 game match.
Parent - - By Cubist (*) Date 2010-02-10 20:37
Books are primarily to aid in engine-vs-engine, centaur, and post-mortem analysis.

With or without a book, Rybka 3 on a quad core would wipe the floor with any player at any point in history.

The time for doubting that is long gone.
Parent - - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) Date 2010-02-10 21:03
Without book, Rybka would have a lot of trouble against a top GM going for very drawish lines.  The book would help to guide the program away from these lines.
Parent - - By Cubist (*) Date 2010-02-10 21:30
I'm pretty sure Rybka 3 on a Quad would defeat any human in history. Engines have come a long way.

I'm surprised people still feel that humans have a chance in matches that contain no handicap.
Parent - - By papacamilla (*) Date 2010-02-11 21:45
Maybe it´s because humans play chess and engines just find moves!?

What could a human proof by accepting a match with an engine??

Engines don´t think, don´t sweat, don´t talk, are never upset - so why spend your time sitting next to them?

There are so many nice guys to play with!!
Parent - By Uly (Gold) Date 2010-02-12 02:45

> Maybe it´s because humans play chess and engines just find moves!?


That's like saying humans do math while calculators just find right results.
Parent - By Cubist (*) Date 2010-02-12 07:28
an engine finds moves no more deterministically than our brain-state processes from birth till death. we just happen to have more nodes but operate at a much lower frequency and are too obfuscated to never make mistakes.

to be clear i'm saying engines never make mistakes. they make unoptimal moves and sometimes even losing moves, but it's always exactly in accordance with the same algorithm executed as coded.
Parent - By Mickey (**) Date 2010-02-12 14:55

> I'm pretty sure Rybka 3 on a Quad would defeat any human in history. Engines have come a long way.


All these statements look like over exaggeration. After all Topalov was able to secure draw against Hydra. All of you seem to ignore human preparation especially if the top GM is aware your cluster is playing without opening book. Engines are quite strong, but most games played by top players fall in line with engines evals.
Parent - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) Date 2010-02-12 15:03
However, a match with no opening book for the computer is a very substantial handicap, worth hundreds of elo against a well-prepared grandmaster (though not worth much at all against a novice).
Parent - - By Geomusic (*****) Date 2010-02-14 08:23
without a book stonewalls become 99% probablity LOL
Parent - - By InspectorGadget (*****) Date 2010-02-14 09:17

> without a book stonewalls become 99% probablity LOL


Will they work against Shredder or R********to? :)
Parent - By Geomusic (*****) Date 2010-02-14 10:59
most masters are more than able to draw death a (C) with no book
- By onedrey Date 2010-02-14 10:19 Edited 2010-02-14 10:27
Without book engine will make the same moves from game to game. GM will lose first several games, but very soon he will find lines which garantee at least draw.
He can also analyze at home with the same engine and find lines where engine fails, and in the game engine will make exactly the same mistakes.
Up Topic The Rybka Lounge / Computer Chess / Cluster vs FIDE Master at Rook-Odds

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