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Up Topic Rybka Support & Discussion / Rybka Discussion / Rybka on Hydra-Type Hardware
- - By DanielRJ (**) [us] Date 2008-03-14 13:19
How easy or difficult would it be to create a version of Rybka that runs on Hydra-type hardware?
Parent - - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2008-03-14 13:27
It would hopefully be not too terribly difficult, considering that many Rybka customers will have this hardware in a few years or so. :-)

Of course, the FPGA cards are quite a different story, and I would guess that many major changes would be needed to take advantage of these.
Parent - - By FirebrandX (**) [us] Date 2008-03-15 18:25
I'd personally like to have Rybka on a Blue Gene/Q system for my own personal use. I believe with a system like that, I might could take first in any freestyle tournament to come up ;-)
Parent - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2008-03-15 18:58
I'd like Zappa on that system.  Then mine would beat your Rybka on that system :-)
Parent - - By Trike (**) Date 2008-03-15 19:15
I believe there will be 2048 cored rybka on the 8th freestyle, I already seen 1024 on playchess. Something like this: Rybka 2.3.2a mp: 28.0 ply; 2561kN/s Quad Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 8354 2212MHz, (1024 threads) and 16cores too if anyone cares: Rybka 2.1d3 mp: 16.8 ply; 2 622kN/s Inter(R) Xeon(R) CPU X7350 @ 2.93GHz 2926MHz, (16 threads) ,it is only 2048 core not 100,000+ like blue gene so we will have just to wait for that. And bunch of skulltrails too are also out there by the way.
Parent - By Mickey (**) [ng] Date 2008-03-15 19:51 Edited 2008-03-15 20:04
It will be interesting to see Rybka 3 vs Hiarcs 12 or Rybka 3 vs Zappa on these amazing machines! Playing chess on these platforms will show who is who among chess engines.http://www.top500.org/files/TOP500_Looking_back_HWM.pdf
Parent - - By saxon (**) [hr] Date 2008-03-20 12:47
I believe there will be 2048 cored rybka on the 8th freestyle, I already seen 1024 on playchess. Something like this: Rybka 2.3.2a mp: 28.0 ply; 2561kN/s Quad Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 8354 2212MHz, (1024 threads) and 16cores too if anyone cares: Rybka 2.1d3 mp: 16.8 ply; 2 622kN/s Inter(R) Xeon(R) CPU X7350 @ 2.93GHz 2926MHz, (16 threads)

What a waste of time ,space and computer power...
Parent - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2008-03-20 13:35
Of course, that statement is definitely a subject of debate.
Parent - - By Vinvin (***) [be] Date 2008-03-20 16:43
I believe there will be 2048 cored rybka on the 8th freestyle, I already seen 1024 on playchess. Something like this: Rybka 2.3.2a mp: 28.0 ply; 2561kN/s Quad Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 8354 2212MHz, (1024 threads)

Rybka 2.3.2a is bad choice here because Rybka 2.3.2a mp is very inefficient on > 8 cores computers , Zappa is very well design on >8 cores.
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2008-03-20 17:29
Zappa is a bad choice because the public versions are limited to a lot less than 2048 cores.
Parent - - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2008-03-20 17:42
But they still go up to 512 cores, and I would guess that Zappa Mexico II on 512 cores would never lose a game against Rybka 2.3.2a on 2048 cores in a 100-game match with opening books similar to those used in Mexico.
Parent - - By Hamlet (**) [ru] Date 2008-03-21 00:16
I don't know. In CC some people run several days per move at top HW. in 120/40 you get about 5 min per move. ratio is about 1000-> almost same thing than having 1000 times faster computer. And they still lose sometimes in top ICCF tournaments.
Parent - - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2008-03-21 00:19
Even if someone had 20 overclocked quads for 20 simultaneous CC games, I would not recommend just leaving them to run.  Human guidance is necessary.

BTW, 120/40 is 3 minutes, not 5--or were you taking into consideration the fact that the first 15 moves tend to be booked?
Parent - - By Hamlet (**) [ru] Date 2008-03-21 11:31

>Even if someone had 20 overclocked quads for 20 simultaneous CC games, I would not recommend just leaving them to run.  >Human guidance is necessary.


a) I have to sleep
b) I have family
c) sometimes I have social life (not very often, unfortunately because I am living abroad in new city and I don't have many new friends yet)
d)  I like to do weekend trips

-> when I don't have time to think my games I just let my computer think. I run engine tournaments (Zappa, Shredder, Fritz, Rybka double round robin with 120/40). I run infinite analysis (quite often in 3- variation mode). When I have time then I start to work with computer output and analyse position with interactive methods. I test some opening positions by letting my computer to play over the weekend at engineroom to find out if others have interesting ideas about these opening positions.

When I and some others are telling that we do very long and cpu time intensive analysis runs it does not mean that we don't do others analysis. It means that we do these long runs in addition our interactive analysis.

>BTW, 120/40 is 3 minutes, not 5--or were you taking into consideration the fact that the first 15 moves tend to be booked?


Yes. I assumed that the 15 first moves are from book.

And finally I would like to give a hyphothetical example:
Player A is fide GM and he plays CC game assisted by rybka. He has old computer and uses 5 min cpu time per move (fast quad equivalent). from freestyle we know that best centaus can add something between 150-200 elo points to rybka.

Player B is postman. He has a fast quad and her runs 2 days per move using rybka.

CPU time ratio between these two players is around 600. If we assume that one additional ply doubles time then player B has 9 plys more than player A. I guess that this 9 ply is worth more than 150 elo points, but
the situation is different if we assume that player A does overnigth analysis (we all sleep at night?) using fast computer.

>Even if someone had 20 overclocked quads for 20 simultaneous CC games,


I am almost sure that van Oosterom have many computers because he is so rich. If I were he I would have 5-6 computers per game + Fide GM-level private secretary :-).
Parent - - By tomski1981 (****) [ca] Date 2008-03-21 13:08
how deep does a quad running for 2 days get you? how many plies?
Parent - - By Kreuzfahrtschiff (***) [de] Date 2008-03-21 15:04
25-30, depends on how much pieces left
Parent - By tomski1981 (****) [ca] Date 2008-03-21 15:10
then 9 ply deeper search is like 21 ply vs 30.. or 16 vs 25.... i'll guess it's worth much more than 150 elo... maybe 300 or more
Parent - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2008-03-21 13:30
I understand what you mean, and obviously if you're not present for the analysis, it is beneficial to have the computers doing something.

I am sure that van Oosterom also guides his analysis quite a bit--or else there would be no use in having 5-6 computers per move.
Parent - By Vinvin (***) [be] Date 2008-03-20 17:44
False statement : you can edit the execultable to allow more threads (more than 2000).
Parent - - By Trike (**) Date 2008-03-20 19:29
Someone also used Intel Nehalem CPU there the other day, don't know really where it came from.
And rybka is somewhat faster on less threads,  Rybka 232a: 29.3 ply; 3,101kN/s Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU X7482 @ 3.00GHz 2993MHz, (32 threads)
Parent - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2008-03-20 19:35
Now we all know what kind of stuff to look forward to in the next Freestyle :-)
Parent - - By Permanent Brain (*****) Date 2008-03-20 20:07
That node rate is bigger than given in the other info, from 1024 threads?! (although, that of course depends a lot on the position, too). Maybe there is a kind of upper limit for the number of cpu cores, where Rybka doesn't gain measurably anymore (or very little) from even more cores?
Parent - By Vasik Rajlich (Silver) [hu] Date 2008-03-27 12:54
I wouldn't spend too much time analyzing this - some people just like to tell stories about their hardware and don't always bother to make everything consistent.

Vas
Parent - - By Permanent Brain (*****) Date 2008-03-20 18:24

> already seen 1024 on playchess. Something like this: Rybka 2.3.2a mp: 28.0 ply; 2561kN/s Quad Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 8354 2212MHz, (1024 threads)


Amazing!
Parent - - By David Evans (***) [gb] Date 2008-03-20 20:18
2048 cored rybka on the 8th freestyle, I already seen 1024 on playchess. Something like this: Rybka 2.3.2a mp: 28.0 ply; 2561kN/s Quad Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 8354 2212MHz, (1024 threads) and 16cores too if anyone cares: Rybka 2.1d3 mp: 16.8 ply; 2 622kN/s Inter(R) Xeon(R) CPU X7350 @ 2.93GHz 2926MHz, (16 threads)

All these machine u have listed here belong to Suj on the playchess server and he does not enter Freestyle any more since they stopped auto engine mode.

If u are lucky like me he may lend u a machine via remote but his larger machines are not available via remote i know i asked.

He can run Rybka on 1024 and zappa on 512 cores but only via a array of switches that will not take remote access so u will not see these machines in freestyle action sorry.

Ultra-d
Parent - By suj (***) Date 2008-03-20 20:35
May be also a nehalem based huge server will take part...if at all Dave wants to use it...

Suj
Parent - By AsosLight (***) [gr] Date 2008-03-21 16:55

>>Rybka 2.3.2a mp: 28.0 ply; 2561kN/s Quad Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 8354 2212MHz, (1024 threads)


That must be fake of course.
Up Topic Rybka Support & Discussion / Rybka Discussion / Rybka on Hydra-Type Hardware

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