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- - By Vasik Rajlich (Silver) [hu] Date 2008-03-03 09:37 Edited 2008-03-08 03:16
Rybka vs Dzindzichashvili - A Pawn and Move

Introduction

Terms and comments by Larry Kaufman

Schedule

Game 1: Dzindzichashvili - Rybka, March 3 12:00 EST (18:00 CET)
Game 2: Dzindzichashvili - Rybka, March 3 17:30 EST
Game 3: Dzindzichashvili - Rybka, March 5 10:30 EST
Game 4: Dzindzichashvili - Rybka, March 5 13:30 EST
Game 5: Dzindzichashvili - Rybka, March 6 10:30 EST
Game 6: Dzindzichashvili - Rybka, March 6 13:30 EST
Game 7: Dzindzichashvili - Rybka, March 7 10:30 EST
Game 8: Dzindzichashvili - Rybka, March 7 13:30 EST

Note: March 4 is a rest day

Broadcast

You can watch the games live either on ChessPlanet or here: http://www.chessok.com/broadcast/live.html

All re-broadcast rights granted.

Games
Game 1: draw
Game 2: Rybka lost
Game 3: Rybka won
Game 4: Rybka won
Game 5: draw
Game 6: draw
Game 7: Rybka lost
Game 8: draw

Analysis
Parent - By InspectorGadget (****) [za] Date 2008-03-03 10:29
I will be glued to my PC to witness Dzindzi frying the fish :)
Parent - By Laszlo (***) [fr] Date 2008-03-03 11:04
Thx, Vas... I will follow it with my unperfect Rybka... :)
Parent - - By Permanent Brain (*****) Date 2008-03-03 11:22 Edited 2008-03-03 11:25
May the best man win! :-D

P.S. What's the first pawn odd, a7 or h7?
Parent - - By Henrik Dinesen (***) [dk] Date 2008-03-03 11:35

> May the best man win! :-D


Hehe, this calls for some gender elaboration; thought Rybka was defined as a female... Hmm, or even more so, one the two chessplaying fishes ;)
Parent - - By FWCC (***) [us] Date 2008-03-03 13:30 Edited 2008-03-03 13:49
Could we please have the live link(Convekta or other)Thanks for links!!May we have a good match.
Parent - By Henrik Dinesen (***) [dk] Date 2008-03-03 14:22
From Vas' post:

Broadcast

You can watch the games live either on ChessPlanet or here: http://www.chessok.com/broadcast/live.html
Parent - - By Roland Rösler (****) [de] Date 2008-03-03 20:49
Every day we have a gap of 3 hours between game 1 and 2, but today we have 5.5 hours. What´s the reason?
Parent - - By lkaufman (*****) Date 2008-03-04 01:15
The reason was that I had to teach a chess class in between.
Parent - By Roland Rösler (****) [de] Date 2008-03-04 01:19
Thanks.
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2008-03-03 22:40 Edited 2008-03-03 22:49
whats hapened to game 2.it says aborted on chess planet. has rybka had a miscarriage.
Parent - - By Felix Kling (Gold) [de] Date 2008-03-03 22:56
game just started. larry said it was because of some computer problems.
Parent - - By FWCC (***) [us] Date 2008-03-03 23:55 Edited 2008-03-04 00:27
Game 2 as of move 30.Dzindzi's eval is dropping-we will see.Ooops  things have changed my bad.
Parent - - By Gaмßito (****) [cr] Date 2008-03-04 00:28 Edited 2008-03-04 00:30
Great Dzindzi!!

Nice game without much complications.  Dzindzi is winning now!!

[#] 1. Nc3 Nc6 2. Ne4 Nb8 3. Nc5 Nc6 4. Nxb7 Nb8 5. Nc5 Nc6 6. Na4 Nb8 7. Nc3 Nc6 8. Nb1 Nb8 ~1 (no b7 pawn) 9. Nf3 Nf6 10. g3 Nc6 11. Bg2 Rb8 12. d4 e6 13. O-O d5 14. b3 Be7 15. Ba3 Bxa3 16. Nxa3 Qd6 17. Nb1 O-O 18. Nc3 h6 19. Re1 Rd8 20. e3 Ba6 21. Na4 Nd7 22. Qd2 Nf6 23. Qc1 Nd7 24. Qd2 Nf6 25. Qc1 Nd7 26. Rd1 Ne7 27. Nd2 Be2 28. Re1 Bb5 29. c4 Bxa4 30. bxa4 Qb4 31. cxd5 Nxd5 32. Bxd5 exd5 33. Nb3 Rb7 34. a5 c5 35. Nxc5 Nxc5 36. Qxc5 Qxc5 37. dxc5 Rc7 38. Rec1 Rdc8 39. Rab1 Rxc5 40. Rxc5 Rxc5 41. Rb8+ Kh7 42. Rb7 Rxa5 43. Rxf7 Rxa2 44. Rd7 a5 45. Rxd5 a4 46. Ra5 g5 47. g4 a3 48. Kg2 Kg7 49. Ra6 Kf7 50. Rxh6 Rb2 51. Ra6 a2 52. Kg3 Re2 53. f3 Ke7 54. e4 Kd8 55. h4 gxh4+ 56. Kxh4

Regards,
Gaмßito.
Parent - By Gaмßito (****) [cr] Date 2008-03-04 00:41
Very good game, as in the same Kramnik style. Very solid chess!

1. Nc3 Nc6 2. Ne4 Nb8 3. Nc5 Nc6 4. Nxb7 Nb8 5. Nc5 Nc6 6. Na4 Nb8 7. Nc3 Nc6 8. Nb1 Nb8 ~1 (no b7 pawn) 9. Nf3 Nf6 10. g3 Nc6 11. Bg2 Rb8 12. d4 e6 13. O-O d5 14. b3 Be7 15. Ba3 Bxa3 16. Nxa3 Qd6 17. Nb1 O-O 18. Nc3 h6 19. Re1 Rd8 20. e3 Ba6 21. Na4 Nd7 22. Qd2 Nf6 23. Qc1 Nd7 24. Qd2 Nf6 25. Qc1 Nd7 26. Rd1 Ne7 27. Nd2 Be2 28. Re1 Bb5 29. c4 Bxa4 30. bxa4 Qb4 31. cxd5 Nxd5 32. Bxd5 exd5 33. Nb3 Rb7 34. a5 c5 35. Nxc5 Nxc5 36. Qxc5 Qxc5 37. dxc5 Rc7 38. Rec1 Rdc8 39. Rab1 Rxc5 40. Rxc5 Rxc5 41. Rb8+ Kh7 42. Rb7 Rxa5 43. Rxf7 Rxa2 44. Rd7 a5 45. Rxd5 a4 46. Ra5 g5 47. g4 a3 48. Kg2 Kg7 49. Ra6 Kf7 50. Rxh6 Rb2 51. Ra6 a2 52. Kg3 Re2 53. f3 Ke7 54. e4 Kd8 55. h4 gxh4+ 56. Kxh4 Kc8 57. Kg5 Kb7 58. Ra3 Kb6 59. f4 Kc5 60. e5 Kb4 61. Ra8 Kb3 62. Kf5 Rc2 63. g5 Rc8 64. Ra6 Rf8+ 65. Kg4 Re8 66. g6 Re6 67. Rxa2 Rxg6+ 68. Kf5 Rb6 69. Rd2 Rb5 70. Kf6 Rb6+ 71. e6 Kc4 72. f5 Kc3 73. Rd8 Ra6 74. Kf7 Ra5 75. f6 1-0

Regards,
Gaмßito.
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2008-03-04 00:32
yeh i was right a miscarriage.
Parent - - By exigentsky (***) [us] Date 2008-03-04 01:11 Edited 2008-03-04 01:18
I am amazed by Dzindzi's performance so far! I honestly didn't expect he would win any games.

After all, a full pawn handicap is worth about 200 ELO. Moreover, there may be a bit of compensation in the open lines. This is especially true for rook pawns which obviously activate the rook and are only about 85% of a pawn anyway. On the other hand, the White pieces are worth about 30 ELO so it probably balances out to still give ~200 ELO for a pawn. Considering that Rybka is almost 3100 ELO at this time control, this would suggest that Roman is performing above 2900 ELO. Maybe the math isn't completely precise but I am still shocked. I wonder if he'll surprise me again.
Parent - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2008-03-04 01:16
But is a pawn handicap really worth 200 elo at the 2600+ level?  (Yes, I know that Dzindzi is currently below that, but he has that experience.)  Just as we see engine-engine matches having a higher percentage of draws due to the drawish nature of the initial position as the levels have increased and the time controls increase, we should expect that as the playing level rises, handicaps in which the initial position is objectively won for one side will tend to show more and more of a tendency toward that side winning.
Parent - - By lkaufman (*****) Date 2008-03-04 01:17
I think that a pawn in top level play is really worth about 300 Elo. I found that it was about 200 Elo in Rybka-vs Rybka games at very short search depths, but this would be very different at tournament levels. Still, Dzindzi is doing very well so far.
Parent - - By FWCC (***) [us] Date 2008-03-04 01:59
Yes Dzindzi is doing very well he did his homework.So I guess to the drawing board Larry? Are you using special contempt values and outlook?
Parent - By lkaufman (*****) Date 2008-03-04 03:56
I don't bother with outlook, but contempt was set for 50. I'm suspicious that this may be too high, I'm investigating the suspicious move 49...Kf7? giving up a pawn for not sufficient reason. It doesn't play this way without contempt.
Parent - - By miguel angel (*) Date 2008-03-04 19:54
As can be understood as rybka exceeds 500 elo Dzindzichashvili on, and so clearly beyond him. Would almost certainly have to reconsider the punctuation elo of chess engines.
Parent - By Permanent Brain (*****) Date 2008-03-04 22:00
For such conclusions, we need to wait for the result from EIGHT games although even that doesn't seem to be enough for reliable conclusions. But TWO games clearly are not enough, yet. Also, it is not clear what difference odds of pawn and moves are, in Elo points.
Parent - By xax [mx] Date 2008-03-05 00:00
I Think that Rybka will win the match but very passive play is bad for the style vs Dzinzi, Lets gooo Rybka ¡¡¡
Parent - By miguel angel (*) Date 2008-03-05 15:29
The game 3 at what time schedule begins on CET
Parent - - By diskamyl (**) [tr] Date 2008-03-05 15:33
isn't game 3 supposed to be started right now?
Parent - - By FWCC (***) [us] Date 2008-03-05 16:43
Dzindzi went for some wild Nf6 move in effect giving the pawn back I think he will be in trouble this game3.I guess he tries to open black's G-file.
Parent - By miguel angel (*) Date 2008-03-05 17:57
Rybka congratulate the team for the game 3, but was matched very long time.
Parent - - By robertj (**) [gb] Date 2008-03-06 15:47 Edited 2008-03-06 16:00
Can't see anything at http://www.chessok.com/broadcast/live.html ...is game 5 already started? Thanks.

Sorry,  I  can see the relay... great, tanks for the broadcast...

...actually the position looks like it is frozen, should I do something to update it?
Parent - - By richbell (**) [in] Date 2008-03-07 17:48
Who thought this match would've been so close? Though i thought it would be close, Rybka would win with something like 5 or 5.5 thinking Dzindzi is not in his prime. He sure had given Rybka a run for its money. I guess he is the best human opponent yet among all Rybka tourney's.  Wonder how a Anand match would be with Rybka :-)
Parent - - By robertj (**) [gb] Date 2008-03-07 18:27
It was a pleasure watching how Dzindzi won in game 7 applying the very principles he teaches in his DVDs :-) ... of course Rybka played without the g-pawn and with black, but still it was nice to see how Roman made Rybka's bishop worth, I would say, less than a pawn, and two rooks possibly not more than a rook and a pawn. Well done Roman!
Parent - - By exigentsky (***) [us] Date 2008-03-07 18:37
I agree. That was by far the most impressive game so far. He showed great foresight and just destroyed Rybka as if she were a patzer.
Parent - - By e4ia [us] Date 2008-03-07 21:14
Hi:

So when may we expect to be able to purchase Ryb 3.0?

Thanks!

Paul
Parent - - By masterchess (***) [us] Date 2008-03-08 14:01
This is my same question! When will we be able to purchase Ryb 3.0?  It has been a very long wait!
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2008-03-08 14:20
Yes, but we're still on the "safe zone."

Once we're in August and it has not been released, THEN it's time to complain, as August is too late of a date, even for the pessimistic.
Parent - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2008-03-08 14:32
when Vas said late spring,i forcasted July so i am very happy at the moment.
Parent - - By Vasik Rajlich (Silver) [hu] Date 2008-03-08 16:54
We don't have a date yet, but it (the date) is coming soon :)

Vas
Parent - - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2008-03-08 18:50
Here's an itinerary for you, Vas:

Week of March 10: Officially post Date A.  Date A will be when you will officially announce the date of the release of Rybka 3.

Date A: Officially announce Date B, which will be the date of the release of Rybka 3.

Date B: Release Rybka 3.

It's as simple as that :-D
Parent - By Ty Nance (**) [us] Date 2008-03-08 18:54
And then I can put myself into a coma, and tell someone to wake me up at date B, as though it were Christmas morning!
Parent - - By Felix Kling (Gold) [de] Date 2008-03-08 19:38
Date B: Admit that it's not ready yet and announce Date C
Date C: Admit that it's not ready yet and announce Date D
Date D: Admit that it's not ready yet and announce Date E
...

What about that?
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2008-03-08 19:55
Date E: Admit that is's not ready and announce the year of Date B.
Parent - - By Harvey Williamson (*****) Date 2008-03-08 20:25
date f admit there is more money in releasing a cook book with Harvey.
Parent - By Felix Kling (Gold) [de] Date 2008-03-09 03:45
Date G: Realising that Rybka is frequently requested by the readers of the cook book ;)
Parent - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2008-03-10 00:02
harvey. i did not realise you were  british correspondece champioin. you hide your light under a bushel.
Parent - - By maxrom (***) [de] Date 2008-03-08 20:31
Maybe in the first half of the year, is a rybka 3 realse in the next 3 months real ?

Vasik, let's say only ( not a date ) if rybka will be realseed in the next 3 Months
Parent - - By Vasik Rajlich (Silver) [hu] Date 2008-03-11 12:14
Sorry, I am really committed to not giving any dates yet - even dates for dates :)

Vas
Parent - - By maxrom (***) [de] Date 2008-03-11 13:15
The wait of the great rybka 3 is very hard !
Parent - - By Wayne Lowrance (***) Date 2008-03-12 19:40
Wow, the expectations are really higher for the Lil girl 3, maybe too high :)
Wayne
Parent - - By Felix Kling (Gold) [de] Date 2008-03-12 19:48
" maybe too high "
...maybe not ;)
Parent - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2008-03-12 20:09
If it will have persistent hash, my expectations aren't too high :)
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