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Parent - By mpx86 (*) Date 2013-05-28 14:16
lol...
Parent - By darmar (**) Date 2013-05-28 11:31
I tested new Critter 2 XXL vs Houdini 3 Pro x64 and Critter is better +50 elo clearly :neutral:
Parent - - By Richard Vida (**) Date 2013-05-28 13:09

> Richard, your silence speaks volumes.


I'm just too busy (and for me it takes quite some effort to write in at least half-decent English).

I already expressed that I do not intend to use any Houdini 3 specific code in upcoming Critter releases. Or is there something more I can do for you?

> ... if you want to work on a compromise solution.


Now I am really curious what kind of compromise do you have on your mind.
Parent - - By Stonehenge (***) Date 2013-05-28 22:20

> I already expressed that I do not intend to use any Houdini 3 specific code in upcoming Critter releases. Or is there something more I can do for you?


Don't play the dummy.
What we want is exactly what I wrote above: "I welcome a new Critter version if it doesn't contain code elements coming from Houdini."

Your upcoming Critter version will have to be released without *any* Houdini code elements - you will have to remove everything you took from Houdini 1.5a (or any other Houdini version for that matter).

This will be my final message in this discussion topic, I hope that you will do the smart thing.
Parent - - By Dr.Wael Deeb (***) Date 2013-05-29 09:11
So in general you want Richard to hand over Critters's source code to look at it
everytime he release a new version...........!?

What about his new ideas that you're gonna take a close look at........!? 

Tra la la la la............
Parent - - By RFK (Gold) Date 2013-05-29 21:46
:grin:

Parent - By Dr.Wael Deeb (***) Date 2013-05-30 09:23
:grin::grin::grin::grin:
Parent - - By Rebel (****) Date 2013-08-21 10:45 Upvotes 1
Said by Mr. code grabber himself.

Wow.....
Parent - By RFK (Gold) Date 2013-08-21 12:44
I found that rather humorous also. Of course, now Robert  Houdart doesn't want anyone else getting  into the cookie jar, although the joke is the jar is being raided ...well its being raided.

Per Richard though, I think it would have been better if he hadn't  produced Robodini - the prank  wasn't worth the blow-back.  However, Richard seems to be right out front with everything he does. If  he says that he's not copying code, I would tend to believe him - and  I hope he  does  continue  his development of Critter.
Parent - - By Rebel (****) Date 2013-08-21 10:56 Upvotes 1
Whatever, at least Richard wrote his own code from SCRATCH. You grabbed your first 3000 elo for free.
Parent - By Nelson Hernandez (Gold) Date 2013-08-21 21:32
Great days in computer chess for "end-users" (to use Bob's pejorative term for The Unanointed).  We're emerging from the dark years, it seems.  Technical progress is being made on multiple fronts (by fair means or foul).  Not a good time for intellectual property rights but if the choice is stagnation or progress I know what path I prefer.  Congrats to all programmers in striking distance of #1 and here's hoping Houdini 4 is a corker.
Parent - - By Banned for Life (Gold) Date 2013-05-21 05:17
Interesting analysis, but it's already well known that you are the best active developer at this point in time, and that Richard's skills in reverse engineering are equally impressive. I would guess that the developers of Komodo are the ones to watch though. With Larry's expertise in tuning, and with the Komodo team having access to your algorithms, you'll be fighting an uphill battle...
Parent - - By oudheusa (*****) Date 2013-05-21 05:46
Wasn't Don on the ICGA witch hunt committee?
Parent - - By Banned for Life (Gold) Date 2013-05-21 07:48
Of course! But that hasn't stopped the Komodo team from testing out algorithms developed and/or refined by Mr. Houdart. Paraphrasing Larry, some worked and some didn't. I guess you could say that Richard went through Houdini forwards and backwards and took many things, and some of them ended up in Komodo! :lol:

Just to be clear though, this kind of thing happens here in the US all of the time, and if the code wasn't copied or translated, Mr. Houdart would be SOL (that's a technical term that means shit outa luck). I think the EU has stricter rules though.

As far as Mr. Houdart's purported use of public domain software, I can remember a similar case here from a number of years ago, but instead of the developer being excoriated by the community, he received a large bonus for taking his company from non-involved, to the industry's dominant player in less than a year. Software reuse. If it's legal, it's a good thing...
Parent - - By oudheusa (*****) Date 2013-05-21 16:56
In other words, a fine example of the hypocracy in the chess programmers world!
Parent - By Ray (****) Date 2013-05-21 19:39

> In other words, a fine example of the hypocracy in the chess programmers world!


Yes.
Parent - - By tomgdrums (****) Date 2013-05-19 11:43
It has been almost 4 years since a new Shredder so that is a lot of development time.

And until recently Shredder 12 managed to hang on in the top ten even with all the other engine development going on around it.
Parent - By RFK (Gold) Date 2013-05-19 16:28
:yell:

It is starting to look like a cloaked " Robodini ":evil: !
Parent - - By Akbarfan (***) Date 2013-05-18 19:47

> The new author (can't remember his name)


Zach Wegner
Parent - - By RFK (Gold) Date 2013-05-18 19:50 Edited 2013-05-18 19:53
So you think it's "Rondo" now also?

If someone spots Hyatt in a moo moo - I'm going to suggest its Crafty!
Parent - By tomgdrums (****) Date 2013-05-19 11:32
I am just spitting in the wind with Rondo.  :)

I actually hope it is Shredder as I always loved that engine, the GUI and SMK's customer service.
Parent - - By RFK (Gold) Date 2013-05-19 04:54
It had better be Komodo MP -after Don's grueling hard work and all the flack for dragging out its development only to have another developer come along and blow him out of the water from behind would be enough to send him into cardiac arrest.
Parent - By tomgdrums (****) Date 2013-05-19 11:43

> It had better be Komodo MP -after Don's grueling hard work and all the flack for dragging out its development only to have another developer come along and blow him out of the water from behind would be enough to send him into cardiac arrest.


:)
Parent - - By cma6 (****) Date 2013-05-19 16:37
Don talks about Komodo 5 MP and Komodo 5.1 MP. Do you know the difference between the two and which one will go out to the purchasers of Komodo 5?
Parent - By MarshallArts (***) Date 2013-05-20 03:59
No difference -- the MP version will be called Komodo 5.1 MP
Parent - By saurus_ (**) Date 2013-05-17 22:32
Latest Stockfish including counter move heuristic?
Parent - - By Akbarfan (***) Date 2013-05-17 23:32
Wow, the new Shredder  :lol::lol:
Parent - By Fulcrum2000 (****) Date 2013-05-17 23:39
Title gave it away I guess? :grin:
Parent - - By Nelson Hernandez (Gold) Date 2013-05-18 01:43
Rybka 5 Alpha version?
Parent - By oudheusa (*****) Date 2013-05-18 11:40
Probably Komodo, but Rybka 5 would be a nice surprise.
Parent - - By Tiranasta (**) Date 2013-05-18 01:50
I'd say new Fritz, based on Fritz 13's absence from the testing, but I don't think there is a new Fritz. :confused:
Parent - By Ingo (***) Date 2013-05-18 05:13

>I'd say new Fritz, based on Fritz 13's absence from the testing, but I don't think there is a new Fritz. :confused:


Fritz (Chessbase native) is never running in the broadcast as the GUI is not suitable to run a propper tourney.

Bye
Ingo
Parent - By cc2150dx (**) Date 2013-05-18 02:36
hmmm...maybe Strelka 5.6/6 or Critter 1.7/2
Parent - By donkasand (***) Date 2013-05-18 02:44
Must be the new Crafty!
Parent - By RFK (Gold) Date 2013-05-18 03:55 Edited 2013-05-18 03:57
Rybka 5 beta (with bugs :twisted:) To start wouldn't be normal to have it any other way! :smile:
Parent - By Chaotic Chess (****) Date 2013-05-18 16:41
This would result in a nice poll!
Parent - By Graham Banks (*****) Date 2013-05-18 23:48
Either a much improved Shredder, or more likely Komodo CCT using time management=3.
Parent - - By mindbreaker (****) Date 2013-05-19 03:54
I am fairly certain it is not a Rybka 4.1 Exp, as he has made it clear he has no interest in them. And, well, they are definitely not that strong. +20 Elo max.  I think I have possibly gone backward recently.  It is so hard to tell without enormous numbers of games.

My up to the min current batch:

5/18/2013 8:53:46 PM :

    Program                          Elo    +   -   Games   Score   Av.Op.  Draws

  1 Houdini 1.5a                   : 2494   62  57 66844    61.8 %   2410   27.9 %
  2 Critter 1.6                    : 2479   13  14 86784    59.8 %   2410   34.9 %
  3 Strelka 5.5 x64                : 2478    3   3 45645    59.6 %   2410   33.3 %
  4 RobboLito 0.21Q x64            : 2425  615 585 65472    52.1 %   2410   37.4 %
  5 Rybka 4.1 Exp 552              : 2416    4   4 21054    50.3 %   2414   33.8 %
  6 Rybka 4.1 Exp 547              : 2415    4   4 21055    50.2 %   2414   33.5 %
  7 Rybka 4.1 Exp 555              : 2414    4   4 21054    50.0 %   2414   33.7 %
  8 Rybka 4.1 Exp 551              : 2413    4   4 21054    49.9 %   2414   32.8 %
  9 Rybka 4.1 Exp 544              : 2412    4   4 21056    49.8 %   2414   34.0 %
10 Rybka 4.1 Exp 545              : 2412    4   4 21055    49.7 %   2414   33.3 %
11 Rybka 4.1 Exp 548              : 2412    4   4 21054    49.7 %   2414   33.5 %
12 Rybka 4.1 Exp 559              : 2412    4   4 21052    49.7 %   2414   33.2 %
13 Rybka 4.1 Exp 556              : 2412    4   4 21054    49.7 %   2414   33.3 %
14 Rybka 4.1 Exp 546              : 2411    4   4 21055    49.6 %   2414   33.1 %
15 Rybka 4.1 Exp 538              : 2411    4   4 21055    49.6 %   2414   33.0 %
16 Rybka 4.1 Exp 563              : 2411    4   4 21052    49.6 %   2414   33.7 %
17 Rybka 4.1 Exp 549              : 2410    4   4 21055    49.5 %   2414   33.3 %
18 Rybka 4.1 Exp 553              : 2410    4   4 21054    49.5 %   2414   33.4 %
19 Rybka 4.1 Exp 561              : 2410    4   4 21052    49.5 %   2414   33.7 %
20 Rybka 4.1 Exp 550              : 2409    4   4 21055    49.3 %   2414   33.1 %
21 Rybka 4.1 Exp 560              : 2409    4   4 21052    49.3 %   2414   33.4 %
22 Rybka 4.1 Exp 557              : 2409    4   4 21053    49.3 %   2414   33.6 %
23 Rybka 4.1 Exp 562              : 2409    4   4 21051    49.2 %   2414   33.5 %
24 Rybka 4.1 Exp 554              : 2408    4   4 21054    49.1 %   2414   33.7 %
25 Rybka 4.1 Exp 558              : 2404    4   4 21053    48.5 %   2414   33.4 %
26 Rybka 4.1 Default              : 2396    4   4 21056    47.4 %   2414   36.4 %
27 Bouquet 1.5                    : 2393  120 125 66132    47.5 %   2410   36.5 %
28 Gull II                        : 2341   23  23 68750    40.1 %   2410   35.3 %
29 StockFish 2.3.1                : 2289    6   6  9746    33.2 %   2410   28.9 %
30 StockFish 3                    : 2281    5   5 53812    32.2 %   2410   28.9 %

Just testing at extreme hyperbbullet speeds.  The error range is large for opponents because one engine or another will do better against it and also they don't play one another only Exps.  The order of opponent also may not be where they would be expected because they are only playing the Exps and also some work better at higher speed than others.
Parent - By mindbreaker (****) Date 2013-05-19 04:01
I think my copy of Critter 1.6 has been learning as well.  It seems to have gotten stronger over a few million games.
Parent - - By Fellowship (**) Date 2013-05-19 10:14 Edited 2013-05-19 11:20
It is shredder..
right click on guess, click on open in new tab  and it shows .
Parent - By siam (**) Date 2013-05-19 11:04
Very smart!:cool:
Parent - By free Willy (*) Date 2013-05-19 13:12
read the Ipon conditions: no inzest test
Parent - By mindbreaker (****) Date 2013-05-19 17:40
The ratings are all relative to Shredder, with Shredder set at 2800 so that could be the reason for the tab name. Though it does look suspicious.
Parent - - By bio (***) Date 2013-05-19 11:08 Edited 2013-05-19 11:14
Well, it looks like that Ingo made a small mistake (or maybe it is a hint for the ones that take a closer look)

Do like that to find out the Name of the engine (for Internet Explorer):
right-click somewhere in the text of the "guess"-Website and choose "Quellcode anzeigen" (in English it should be something similar to "Show Sourcecode")

And at the beginning you will see "..........."  :twisted:

or like this: right-click and choose "properties" (the very last Option)
Parent - - By Fulcrum2000 (****) Date 2013-05-19 11:10
Yes, that is what Akbarfan and myself found out yesterday, see posts above. :cool:
Parent - By bio (***) Date 2013-05-19 11:13
I did see that, but I wanted to show the not-so-nerds how to find it out :smile:
Parent - - By free Willy (*) Date 2013-05-19 15:15
what to you see with this option right klick and properties is the gui name: Ingo uses the shredder gui
Parent - By šachista (*) Date 2013-05-19 16:07 Upvotes 1
Indeed,  you can also see the title "Shredder" for Booot for example.
Parent - By RFK (Gold) Date 2013-05-19 15:50
Or left a clue for someone to find (if this comes to be in fact the case).  He would have reason to be proud  of such an accomplishment in  Stefan Meyer-Kahlen current programming prowess  in bringing Shredder back into prominence -it would be a glowing moment.
Parent - By RFK (Gold) Date 2013-05-19 16:11
There is always the chance that "Shredder" on the right click on "Gues" is nothing but a sub-handle for the site. :twisted:
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