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Up Topic Correspondence Chess / Correspondence Chess / NATIONAL12-Moz (Cochrane Gambit).
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- - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-07-24 22:51
1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nxf7 Kxf7 5.d4

rnbq1b1r/ppp2kpp/3p1n2/8/3PP3/8/PPP2PPP/RNBQKB1R b KQ d3 0 5
Parent - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-07-24 22:58
i,along with others believe this opening is unsound.i played Mark as black in this opening and won.However Moz appears to think its ok with 5.Nc3.i doubt it.however i will play white here and play Marks move 5.d4 and see how long i can hang on in there.:smile:After this game i would be happy to play black against Moz line 5.Nc3.

lets have some fun and see if i can improve on Marks play with white.
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2011-07-25 05:09
Good luck Paul! Moz knows what he's doing in these kind of positions, so this game will be very interesting.
Parent - By Moz (****) Date 2011-07-26 05:55 Edited 2011-07-26 05:59
It says a lot about me that I'd rather be playing white in this position!  Well, actually, I'd prefer 5.Nc3 as I think d4 is somewhat dubious but I'm still much more comfortable playing the speculative side.  I think 5.Nc3 is the true test of the gambit.

I'm busy at the moment so I probably won't begin the game for a day or two. Please be patient. Thanks.
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-07-28 02:42
1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nxf7 Kxf7 5.d4 c5

rnbq1b1r/pp3kpp/3p1n2/2p5/3PP3/8/PPP2PPP/RNBQKB1R w KQ - 0 6


I think there are a number of moves that are viable in this position but I'm curious to see where you'll deviate from your game against Mark so c5 it is.
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-07-28 08:37
well we can start now.

6.Bc4+
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-07-29 03:04
6...d5
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-07-29 07:19
7.exd5
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-07-30 14:57
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6

rnbq3r/pp3kpp/3b1n2/2pP4/2BP4/8/PPP2PPP/RNBQK2R w KQ - 0 8


The game is afoot!
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-07-30 15:46
yes indeed,i thought 7...b5 was most likely move,nothing wrong with Bd6 though.
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-07-30 15:51

> yes indeed,i thought 7...b5 was most likely move,nothing wrong with Bd6 though.


Yeah, I looked at both moves closely and didn't like the looks of white's bishop pair in the 7...b5 lines. 
7...Bd6 was much more interesting (and volatile!)
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-07-30 16:08
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.0-0

rnbq3r/pp3kpp/3b1n2/2pP4/2BP4/8/PPP2PPP/RNBQ1RK1 b - - 0 8
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-07-30 16:27
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.0-0 Nbd7
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-07-31 06:37
9.Nc3
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-07-31 15:59
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6

r1bq3r/1p1n1kpp/p2b1n2/2pP4/2BP4/2N5/PPP2PPP/R1BQ1RK1 w - - 0 10
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-07-31 16:15
10.dxc5
Parent - By Moz (****) Date 2011-07-31 16:19
10...Nxc5
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-07-31 16:24
FYI : I will probably take a couple of days to respond to your next move, whatever it is.
Parent - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-07-31 16:28
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.b4

r1bq3r/1p3kpp/p2b1n2/2nP4/1PB5/2N5/P1P2PPP/R1BQ1RK1 b - b3 0 11
- - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-09 04:33
11...Ncd7
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-10 11:38
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.b4 Ncd7 12.Bb3

r1bq3r/1p1n1kpp/p2b1n2/3P4/1P6/1BN5/P1P2PPP/R1BQ1RK1 b - - 0 12
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-11 03:07
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.b4 Ncd7 12.Bb3 Re8
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-11 08:49
13.a3
Parent - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-13 15:02
13...b5
- - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-13 16:10
The game is about to get very interesting.
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-13 21:35
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.b4 Ncd7 12.Bb3 Re8 13.a3 b5 14.Be3

r1bqr3/3n1kpp/p2b1n2/1p1P4/1P6/PBN1B3/2P2PPP/R2Q1RK1 b - - 0 14
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-14 00:22
14...Qc7
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-14 04:26
15.Bf4
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-14 05:06
15...Ne5
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-14 11:05
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.b4 Ncd7 12.Bb3 Re8 13.a3 b5 14.Be3 Qc7
15.Bf4 Ne5 16.Qd4

r1b1r3/2q2kpp/p2b1n2/1p1Pn3/1P1Q1B2/PBN5/2P2PPP/R4RK1 b - - 0 16
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-14 17:24
16...Kf8
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-14 20:16
17.Bg3
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-14 22:18
17...Bf5
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-14 22:50
18.Rae1
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-14 23:07
18...Rac8
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-15 14:33
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.b4 Ncd7 12.Bb3 Re8 13.a3 b5 14.Be3 Qc7
15.Bf4 Ne5 16.Qd4 Kf8 17.Bg3 Bf5 18.Rae1 Rac8 19.Re3

2r1rk2/2q3pp/p2b1n2/1p1Pnb2/1P1Q4/PBN1R1B1/2P2PPP/5RK1 b - - 0 19
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-15 14:35
i think its the beginning of the end for white.
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-16 02:19
White might be able to escape with a drawish endgame but the evals are definitely trending in black's favor at the moment. If it's any comfort, the evals are much worse for white in my game against Uly and that one looks dead drawn after the better part of a month spent looking for a damn win.

19...Nc4

2r1rk2/2q3pp/p2b1n2/1p1P1b2/1PnQ4/PBN1R1B1/2P2PPP/5RK1 w - - 0 20
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-16 07:55
20.Rxe8+
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-16 20:52
20...Nxe8
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-16 22:48
for some reason i got it into my head that you would play 20...Rxe8 and spent some time looking at this.I am unsure which move is best,but of course black has a lot more options than white,i wont be replying tonight.:smile:
Parent - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-17 02:37

> for some reason i got it into my head that you would play 20...Rxe8 and spent some time looking at this.I am unsure which move is best,but of course black has a lot more options than white,i wont be replying tonight.


Maybe I should have...I had Nxe8 with a slightly better score and thought it important to maintain the pressure on white's c-pawn. I probably shouldn't have pulled the trigger so quickly but what's done is done.
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2011-08-17 02:30

> If it's any comfort, the evals are much worse for white in my game against Uly and that one looks dead drawn after the better part of a month spent looking for a damn win.


Some good news for me! :smile:

I'd like to say that I appreciate all the work you've put in that game, and that a lot of the improvements in my analysis methods were thanks to you and that game (mainly, a core concept of not taking high evaluations as "won" or 0.00 evaluations as "drawn" and prune them, but to investigate them to see if it's engines who are clueless).
Parent - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-17 02:35

>> Some good news for me! :smile:
>
> I'd like to say that I appreciate all the work you've put in that game, and that a lot of the improvements in my analysis methods were thanks to you and that game (mainly, a core concept of not taking high evaluations as "won" or 0.00 evaluations as "drawn" and prune them, but to investigate them to see if it's engines who are clueless).


I was prepared to offer a draw earlier but decided to give it everything I had after you asked me to play on.  I spent a LOT of time on the game and can't find anything convincing. The bishop pair is simply too strong.
- - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-17 09:21
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.b4 Ncd7 12.Bb3 Re8 13.a3 b5 14.Be3 Qc7
15.Bf4 Ne5 16.Qd4 Kf8 17.Bg3 Bf5 18.Rae1 Rac8 19.Re3 Nc4 20.Rxe8+ Nxe8
21.Nd1

2r1nk2/2q3pp/p2b4/1p1P1b2/1PnQ4/PB4B1/2P2PPP/3N1RK1 b - - 0 21
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-18 01:44
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.b4 Ncd7 12.Bb3 Re8 13.a3 b5 14.Be3 Qc7
15.Bf4 Ne5 16.Qd4 Kf8 17.Bg3 Bf5 18.Rae1 Rac8 19.Re3 Nc4 20.Rxe8+ Nxe8
21.Nd1 Qb6
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-18 06:56
22.Qxb6
Parent - - By Moz (****) Date 2011-08-18 15:46
22...Nxb6
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-18 16:10
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3. Nxe5 d6 4. Nxf7 Kxf7 5. d4 c5 6. Bc4+ d5 7. exd5 Bd6 8.
O-O Nbd7 9. Nc3 a6 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.b4 Ncd7 12.Bb3 Re8 13.a3 b5 14.Be3 Qc7
15.Bf4 Ne5 16.Qd4 Kf8 17.Bg3 Bf5 18.Rae1 Rac8 19.Re3 Nc4 20.Rxe8+ Nxe8
21.Nd1 Qb6 22.Qxb6 Nxb6 23.Ne3

2r1nk2/6pp/pn1b4/1p1P1b2/1P6/PB2N1B1/2P2PPP/5RK1 b - - 0 23
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2011-08-19 00:01
to be fair to you Moz despite much AN i could not decide which move you will play here Bg6 or Bd7.i am trying really hard to save this game as you know.
Up Topic Correspondence Chess / Correspondence Chess / NATIONAL12-Moz (Cochrane Gambit).
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