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Up Topic Rybka Support & Discussion / Rybka Discussion / Rybka 3: some engine to engine matches help for a noob
- - By f1refly Date 2009-08-05 17:02
I'm running some engine vs engine games against rybka, including the king (chessmaster) lol, then trying to configure the losing engine enough to beat it. maybe sounds stupid but its just for fun.
Anyway, what kind of configurations makes computer engines the strongest...like should i use Tablebases or books? Engine pondering on/off?. hashtable sizes?

I'm hoping to take other engines like shredder 10..etc and make them learn from Rybka's wins...how do i do that? i know engines can learn somehow but it requires books to be on right?
I then want to tweak parameters of the losing engine all in an effort to beat ryka's strongest settings or tie it on average....is this idea impossible? i figured if another engine can learn from rybka, and with some parameter tweaking i'd have some interesting results in gameplay, but i'm just a novice chess player, i dont even understand how to analyse games to better myself so i was just trying to have some fun with it.

I'd like to play it against chessmaster 11 (i have CM 8 engine as uci) but is there a way to make CM 11's engine UCI like you can with the old 8th version?

CM 11 is alot easier to learn game tactics, but its far weaker than Rybka 3, something else i'd like to do is figure out how i can better my own gameplay and learn from Rybka, is there any other program that teaches me easier than having to manually analyse databases? cause i dont even understand how one can learn from it. I love chess and played all my life but i just suck at it.
Parent - By keoki010 (Silver) Date 2009-08-05 17:06
CM is one of the best at teaching basics.  Go into the tutorials and start from where you think you should be in skill level. 
Parent - By yanquis1972 (****) Date 2009-08-05 18:25
rybka is a program for analyzing, not learning (imo).  CM 11 sounds like a great program for you to me, it has lots of tutorials on all phases of the game (far from just tactics). shredder 12 should be very good as well, though it keeps getting pushed back (now its supposedly due in sept).

ill PM u about cm 11 uci since im not 100% sure about...everything.

for strongest engine play, the most important things would be a decent opening book & pondering (but only use ponder for engine-engine matches if u have 2 processors).  tablebases are about a 20GB (free) download & dont add a whole lot of strength to an engine like rybka but theyre useful for analysis purposes.
- - By f1refly Date 2009-08-05 23:04
thanks guys, so does anyone know about the engine learning thing? Like is it even possible for another engine to learn from rybka's moves? and then tweak it some to beat it? or is that part a waste of time.

as for the analysis thing...dont you guys use analysis to learn? perhaps i just dont understand the concept of analysis. sorry i'm new to chessbase, but i have been playing chess off/on for like 27 years or something but just casually.

one last question: How should i go about learning how to think more moves ahead? I was never very good at setting up position, everything i've learned over the last 27 years of playing is trial and error from playing other people. its long overdue that i try to learn position but i think i'm getting too impatient as i get older.
Parent - By Uly (Gold) Date 2009-08-06 00:09

> Like is it even possible for another engine to learn from rybka's moves?


Yes, Romichess for example has a "Monkey see monkey do" learning function, where she could play Rybka's moves against her in future games, doing exactly what you want.

> And then tweak it some to beat it?


No, you can't do this by learning alone, if this was possible, Rybka's competition would have put their engine to learn Rybka's moves long time ago and tweak it to beat Rybka, but in reality chess is so complex than much sooner than you believe you're going to be on a chess position where you don't have any Rybka move left and will have to play on your own, that's where Rybka will defeat you.

As for engine personalities that beat Rybka, that's a theoretical possibility, but personality tweaking experts have been playing with CMXI personalities for a long while, with personalities that can be stronger than CMDefault, but Chessmaster's weaknesses are inherent and can't be fixed by just changing the parameters, so it's extremely probable that no personality that beats Rybka could be made, the strength maxes out at some point.

As for learning, having the engine's best move on a position and memorizing it doesn't work beyond opening traps, it's the same concept, your opponent is eventually going to play into a position you've never seen before in where you're on your own, and pattern recognition is going to be key. So, spend your time learning new patterns and improving your tactics, if you want to become stronger.
Up Topic Rybka Support & Discussion / Rybka Discussion / Rybka 3: some engine to engine matches help for a noob

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