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Up Topic The Rybka Lounge / Computer Chess / Sicilian Najdorf,Scheveningen,Kan with 6.Be3 and 7.a3
- - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-04 07:14 Edited 2017-02-04 08:14 Upvotes 1
after the often played
1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6

[6...e5 7.Nb3 is the alternative, also often played]

Stockfish want to play the uncommon 7.a3 as best move at most depths.
e.g. +0.19d52 (pv=a3,Be7,Qe2,e5) . 7.a3 and 7.Be2 are usually the most
considered moves at each depth, while the common Qf3,Qd2,f3 are abandonned
at depth ~30 and evaluated as 0.00.

Why a3 ? Preventing b5-b4 ? But we could wait with that until b5 is actually played ?!
It took me a while to understand this. White wants to play g4, if possible without f3,
but immediate 7.g4 is not good because of 7...e5,Nf5,g6 , but after
7.a3 b5 8.g4 e5 9.Nf5 g6 White has 10.Bg2 .
[fen] rnbqkb1r/5p1p/p2p1np1/1p2pN2/4P1P1/P1NB3/1PP2PBP/R2QK2R b KQkq 10 5 [/fen]
1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6 7.a3 b5 8.g4 e5 9.Nf5 g6 10.Bg2
Maybe this was overlooked often and the reason why 7.a3 got so little attention ?

After 7.a3 Be7 the usual 8.f3 (intending Qd2,000,g4) can be played,
because Be7 does not much to support the idea of equalizing d5 .

Anyway, I needn't understand, stockfish knows what it does and has much more Elo than me.

Houdini agrees on 7.a3 - at least as 2nd best after Be2.

Komodo 10.2 is not so sure ... until depth 31 it has 7.a3 not among it's 4 best moves.
Then it has 7.a3 with eval +0.17 at depth 30,31,34 but not at depth 32,33
Maybe someone wants to check this.

I think this is an amazing novelty in an often played variation and mankind somehow
missed it despite so many books and games and analysis.

CCRL 40/40 has no game with a3 (out of 680000) , Noomen-book has 6 games
with 7.a3 (but 6059 games with 7.f3) , Fernschach CD has 18 games (out of 1M)
15 of them from 2013-2016.

...

I put analysis updates here : http://magictour.free.fr/7a3
Parent - - By Nelson Hernandez (Gold) [us] Date 2017-02-04 18:26
Interesting...7.a3 was first played in a human game in 1989 though the position after a3 was achieved by transposition in 1964.  The first engine game I have is from 2003, Deep Fritz 7 producing the move.

But what's more interesting is that this move was actually somewhat popular from 2006-2008 on Playchess.  Apparently Rybka 2.1 through 2.3 liked it.  It peaked in 2007 with over 500 instances and then quickly fell out of favor.  During 2011-2013 I have just 10-12 games each year but it has been rallying back lately thanks to Stockfish (though still nowhere near its heyday ten years ago).

Which goes to show things go in and out of fashion continually as our analysis tools improve.  Some things SF is discovering today at d50 may seem quaint ten years from now.
Parent - - By David Evans (****) [gb] Date 2017-02-04 23:01
[Event "7th PAL/CSS Freestyle Tournament"]
[Site "90m+30s, playchess.com"]
[Date "2007.09.15"]
[Round "6"]
[White "Ultra-d"]
[Black "Etaoin Shrdlu"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B80"]
[WhiteElo "2631"]
[BlackElo "2727"]
[PlyCount "55"]
[EventDate "2007.09.??"]
[EventType "swiss"]
[EventRounds "9"]

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 a6 6. Be3 e6 7. a3 b5 8. f3
Bb7 9. Qd2 Nbd7 10. O-O-O Ne5 11. g4 Nfd7 12. g5 Nb6 13. f4 Nec4 14. Qf2 Rc8
15. Bxc4 Nxc4 16. Rd3 Qb6 17. f5 Nxe3 18. fxe6 fxe6 19. Qxe3 e5 20. Nf5 Qxe3+
21. Nxe3 g6 22. Ned5 Be7 23. Nxe7 Kxe7 24. Rhd1 Rcd8 25. Rf3 Rdf8 26. Rdf1 Rxf3
27. Rxf3 h6 28. Rh3 1/2-1/2

Here is one of my examples i have some interesting stuff on 7 a3 it is what i would call of interest i could debate this line four hours but not many would listen these days many have lost their appetite for such nonsense :lol:
Parent - - By Nelson Hernandez (Gold) [us] Date 2017-02-05 16:06
:cool:  We won that tournament!
Parent - By David Evans (****) [gb] Date 2017-02-05 17:57
Yes it was a time of exploration sadly no more.
Parent - - By Master Om (Bronze) [in] Date 2017-02-08 17:19
[Event "7th PAL/CSS Freestyle Tournament"]
[Site "90m+30s, playchess.com"]
[Date "2007.09.15"]
[Round "6"]
[White "Ultra-d"]
[Black "Etaoin Shrdlu"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B80"]
[WhiteElo "2631"]
[BlackElo "2727"]
[PlyCount "55"]
[EventDate "2007.09.??"]
[EventType "swiss"]
[EventRounds "9"]

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 a6 6. Be3 e6 7. a3 b5 8. f3
Bb7 9. Qd2 Nbd7 10. O-O-O Ne5 11. g4 Nfd7 12. g5 Nb6 13. f4 Nec4 14. Qf2 Rc8
15. Bxc4 Nxc4 16. Rd3 Qb6 17. f5 Nxe3 18. fxe6 fxe6 19. Qxe3 e5 20. Nf5 Qxe3+
21. Nxe3 g6 22. Ned5 Be7 23. Nxe7 Kxe7 24. Rhd1 Rcd8 25. Rf3 Rdf8 26. Rdf1 Rxf3
27. Rxf3 h6 28. Rh3 1/2-1/2
Parent - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-09 04:39 Edited 2017-02-09 07:42
this is more like a transposition to the common 7.f3 line.
One point of 7.a3 is to play directly 8.g4 on 7...b5 ,
without f3.  A Bg2 can protect e4 instead of a Pf3.
Parent - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-05 05:24
they often "see" something at lower depth and then see something else
and change the best move, almost unpredictable.
But I assume that at high depth most of the engines consider 7.a3
among the top moves.
Houdini had a3 at depths 14-17, then again at depths > 23
as best or 2nd best. I would not be surprised if it's similar with Rybka.

Reluctant was Komodo 10.2 , who only had 7.a3 at depth 30
under the best 4 moves then at 31, not at 32,33 and again at 34,35
Komodo evals depths 30-35, multipv=4
Be2:21,22,18,16,22,24
a3:17,17,00,00,17,15
Qf3:15,15,08,18,11,14
Parent - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-05 06:46 Edited 2017-02-05 06:52
it would be interesting to see Rybka 2.3 multipv evals at different depths after 6...e6 .
Someone has Rybka 2.1 or 2.2 or 2.3 ?

key could be at what depth they see (at move 7) the asmfish-trap 7.a3,b5,g4,e5?,Nf5,g6,Bg2
Parent - - By leavenfish (***) [us] Date 2017-02-04 18:57
"I think this is an amazing novelty in an often played variation and mankind somehow
missed it despite so many books and games and analysis."

LOL! :roll:

I do love to see comments like these on sites dedicated to 'computer chess'.
It's not an especially 'bad' move...but it has no point. There are better, plain and simple.
Parent - - By Nelson Hernandez (Gold) [us] Date 2017-02-04 19:06

> It's not an especially 'bad' move...but it has no point.


In human chess terms you are probably right.  But in computer chess terms it very much has a point: there isn't much theory in circulation and it is a playable move, in fact, the strongest program in the world right now thinks it is the best move (for whatever reason).  Until we know, definitively, that it is a won, lost or drawn move all sources--past games, engine analysis, chess principles--have to be considered and discounted as suggestive but imperfect.
Parent - - By leavenfish (***) [us] Date 2017-02-05 18:11
True, this is a 'computer chess' page...so most everything said about chess 'as a game' here has to be considered as coming thru the lense of those who play this 'computer chess'. It is no secret that I consider it a (mild and frivolous) abomination...I just like to visit the page for engine info, but this caught my eye.

IMHO
only when something can be understood can it be said to have a point...that really should be self evident ...until then it is mere groping in the dark.  When you say "Until we know, definitively, that it is a won, lost or drawn move all sources--past games, engine analysis, chess principles--have to be considered and discounted as suggestive but imperfect."   well, honestly that is a bit of a cop-out and magical thinking. I'm not saying it cannot lead to 'something', but generally it is the idea that precedes the move. It is the idea of a pyramid before a pyramid was built...it is the idea of the atom bomb before the atom bomb was built...else you are merely doing the I Ching -  tossing the sticks about and then trying to attribute 'reason' to what you see.  That's very...'creative' :roll: I guess, but as the Brits say: That's not Cricket.

My thoroughly human perspective for someone on the Black side is to not be so quick to play ...b5, develop differently (maybe like you are playing a Schevenigan) and likely 0-0. a3 simply makes for a long-term 'hook' for Black to latch onto with ...b5-b4, particularly should White still 0-0-0. I mean, THINK about it: on opposite side castling, one does not wish to move a pawn by the king unless one needs to. On same side castling...a3 could be a mere waste of time. It's why the OKelly variation of the Sicilian 'works' only when White plays. 3.d4...against 3. c3 or 3. c4 it turns out to make life a little more difficult for Black than had he played a more reasonable move so early in the game.

But again, that's just one poor human brain with 30+ years of tournament play under his belt speaking.  Please forgive me for sinning all over this thread.
Parent - - By Nelson Hernandez (Gold) [us] Date 2017-02-06 13:27
I am not an obscurantist.  I'm merely saying that there is danger in making categorical statements (e.g. "no point") when corresponding proofs are not available.  What is the best we can do?  Examine what we do know, propose hypotheses, experiment, or as you say grope in the dark.
Parent - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-06 13:50
Stockfish with Elo 3400 says, that it's not about "ideas" but just about calculating and depth.
Or better : the idea is so complicated that humans don't easily grasp it.

We tell beginners not to play these moves like a3 and h6 when we are afraid of Bb4,Bg5,
it costs time and there are usually better methods to deal with that.
Now Stockfish, Houdini play a3 and h6 even before b4 or g5 is imminent.
Because of subtleties with the move order.
How would you explain that to the audience, if you one day give a talk about 7.a3 ?
Parent - - By leavenfish (***) [us] Date 2017-02-07 02:17
and I'm merely saying...."Only when something can be understood can it be said to have a point...." and that's just basic logic.


As concerns gsgs's comment: Stockfish with Elo 3400 says, that it's not about "ideas" but just about calculating and depth

I can't help but laugh. I guess Stockfish has 'solved chess' and we can all go home... :wink:
Parent - - By Nelson Hernandez (Gold) [us] Date 2017-02-09 05:15
By your standard no computer analysis has a point because computers don't "understand" anything.  They lack cognition.  They can only provide an illusion of understanding.  Computers don't make "points" nor do they understand positions.

I suspect this is a deeper philosophical line of argument than any of us is qualified to sensibly discuss.  Yet I suspect we're treading on a continuum between "calculation ultimately solves finite problems like chess" and "calculation is not understanding".  Is it possible both ends of this argument are correct?
Parent - - By leavenfish (***) [us] Date 2017-02-11 17:33
In a sense they 'do understand' positions, in that by virtue of assigning weights to programmed ideas (weak squares, backward isolated pawns, open positions with bishops, etc, etc) and then calculating around those which it sees in its search... they playing accordingly. But of course, that ALL depends on what some human has 'put in the code' and it's 'understanding' is seen in the numeric value assigned to the given more.

Now that said, all 'understanding' is not equal or else depth of search would always be the deciding factor in engine vs engine match ups. Further, a +.22 edge vs a +.75 edge for example shows a level of  'understanding'. The latter contains  'more certainty' while the closer you get '0', the more likely a move is to fall into a big pot of possibilities which 'may' be as good as similarly moves in a small range above 0 which essentially are 'equal' which mean you can chose any of those and continue and hope that at some point your opponent (and not you!) starts misevaluating (even ever so slightly) things.

So, what I am saying is that there is more likely to be a discernable (to us especially, but also to a program) 'point' to a move with a higher evaluation whereas something like a3 in question here is 'just a move' along with others which are likely no better or no worse than other possibilities. For me, it is a bit like the different levels of thinking in poker (some might argue I am stretching that point beyond how one refers to it in poker). a3 doesn't do anything...it's maybe a sign of a program not really knowing what to do and overthinking things...because it's a contest between two participants and a good second player could essentially consider a3 a 'pass' and be able to make use of the pass. I know someone who always plays ...h6 early in a game because he simply cannot deal with the thought of Bg5 pinning Nf6. He plays 'h6', so I (and Bg5 may rarely be played in my opening!) essentially get him passing so that I can advantageously develop my bishop to a different square and carry out the fight in a different way. Heck, in some lines I get to 0-0-0 when long term ...h6 might just turn into a 'hook' upon which to throw my g pawn and open up his kingside.
Parent - By siah (***) Date 2017-02-13 16:16 Edited 2017-02-13 16:19
Hey NeliDez! Re-edit this topic for half an hour please!
Parent - By turbojuice1122 (Gold) [us] Date 2017-02-05 20:06
I think that it has several potential purposes.  First, it can prevent an untimely ...Nb4 if white has a desire to place a bishop or even a queen on d3 somewhere down the road.  Second, it prepares b4 when there is a knight on c6, with the plan of a possible b5 push.  Third, it might actuallly be that most of black's moves in this situation make his position slightly worse :twisted:, and how white should react depends on which move he plays.
Parent - - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-05 05:13 Edited 2017-02-05 06:58
Stockfish thinks a3 has to be played anyway , since black's best lines contain b5.
While the usual 7.f3 to prepare g4 is maybe not necessary or can be delayed or only
played when black plays Be7.
I have another line now, where Stockfish/Asmfish wants to play a3, that is after  6.f3,e6.
The best defense for black -according to Stockfish- usually contains h6 to prevent g5.
In most variations Black wants to play d5.
Check the updates at http://magictour.free.fr/7a3

Here are 2 current droidfish screenshots
http://magictour.free.fr/7a3a.PNG
http://magictour.free.fr/7a3b.PNG
+0.19 depth 52 multipv=1 , wants to play a3 with pv=Be7,Qe2,e5
(at lower depths it wanted to play f3 on Be7, evals ~ 0.15-0.20 )

The second is multipv=4, depth 47
a3=0.30,Qf3=0.11,Be2=0.05,f3=0.00

I expect that this changes at depth 48 and a3 goes back to ~0.20 Be2 up to
0.10-0.15 , Qf3 to 0.00

The main line 7.f3,b5,8.g4,h6,9.Qd2,Bb7 is 0.00

and btw. I examined 6.Be3,e5 first but it was good for white (+0.20 , depth 57)
so I examined 6...e6
Parent - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-06 13:57
googling for "1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6"
Page 9 of about 84 results

googling for "1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6 7.f3"
Page 10 of about 89 results

googling for   1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6 7.a3 
gives no results yet.
Your search - "1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6 7.a3" -
did not match any documents.

so, now hopefully google catches this very post here and others discovering
and analysing this line are directed to this thread.
Parent - - By user923005 (****) [us] Date 2017-02-09 21:30
Komodo:
rnbqkb1r/1p3ppp/p2ppn2/8/3NP3/2N1B3/PPP2PPP/R2QKB1R w KQkq -
  acd 33; acs 6455 ; acn 5477202808; ce 16 ; bm Be2; pv Be2 Qc7 f3 b5 Qd2 Nbd7 a3 Ne5 0-0-0 Rb8 Kb1 Nc4 Bxc4 bxc4 Ka1 h6 g4 Nd7 h4 h5 g5 Ne5 f4 Ng4 Nf3 Be7 Bd4 0-0 Rhf1 Bd7 Qe2 Qb7 Rb1 Qc7 Rfd1 Rfc8 Qg2;
rnbqkb1r/1p3ppp/p2ppn2/8/3NP3/2N1BP2/PPP3PP/R2QKB1R b KQkq -
  acd 36; acs 6407 ; acn 5712889065; ce 0 ; bm b5; pv b5 Qd2 Nbd7 a3 Bb7 0-0-0 Rc8 Kb1 Be7 g4 Nb6 g5 Nfd7 Nb3 0-0 h4 Ne5 Na5 Ba8 Be2 Nbd7 Nb3 Nb6 Na5;
rnbqkb1r/1p3ppp/p2ppn2/8/3NP3/P1N1B3/1PP2PPP/R2QKB1R b KQkq -
  acd 32+; acs 6325 ; acn 5597107527; ce -14 ; bm Nbd7; pv Nbd7 g4 h6;
rnbqkb1r/5ppp/p2ppn2/1p6/3NP3/P1N1BP2/1PP3PP/R2QKB1R b KQkq -
  acd 35-; acs 5049 ; acn 4711735348; ce -14 ; bm Bb7; pv Bb7 g4;

Houdini:
rnbqkb1r/1p3ppp/p2ppn2/8/3NP3/2N1B3/PPP2PPP/R2QKB1R w KQkq -
  acd 30/57; acs 680 ; acn 6720893355; ce 26 ; bm Be2; pv Be2 Qc7 Qd2 b5 a3 Bb7 f3 d5 e5 Nfd7 f4 Nc6 0-0 Bc5 Bf3 Nxd4 Bxd4 Bxd4+ Qxd4 0-0 a4 bxa4 Rxa4 a5 Ra2 Rfc8 Rfa1 Qc5 Qxc5 Rxc5 g3 Bc6 Ne2 Rxc2 Nd4 Rc4;
rnbqkb1r/1p3ppp/p2ppn2/8/3NP3/2N1BP2/PPP3PP/R2QKB1R b KQkq -
  acd 30/59; acs 1020 ; acn 10094866733; ce -5 ; bm b5; pv b5 a3 h5 Qd2 Bb7 0-0-0 Nbd7 Bf2 Be7 Kb1 Rc8 Qe1 Qc7 h3 g6 Bd3 Nc5 Bh4 0-0 Nb3 Nxb3 cxb3 d5 e5 Nh7 Bxe7 Qxe7 h4 d4 Ne2 Rfd8 Qg3 Nf8;
rnbqkb1r/1p3ppp/p2ppn2/8/3NP3/P1N1B3/1PP2PPP/R2QKB1R b KQkq -
  acd 30/60; acs 3405 ; acn 33605380876; ce -28 ; bm Be7; pv Be7 f3 0-0 Qd2 d5 e5 Nfd7 f4 Nc6 g3 Nxd4 Bxd4 b5 Bg2 Bb7 0-0 Qc7 Qf2 Rac8 Rac1 h6 Rfd1 f6 exf6 Bxf6 Rd2 Bxd4 Qxd4 Qb6 Re1 Qxd4+ Rxd4 Kf7 Bf3;
rnbqkb1r/5ppp/p2ppn2/1p6/3NP3/P1N1BP2/1PP3PP/R2QKB1R b KQkq -
  acd 30/59; acs 1089 ; acn 10747260940; ce -6 ; bm h5; pv h5 Qd2 Nbd7 0-0-0 Bb7 h3 Be7 Rg1 h4 Kb1 Rc8 Bf2 Nh5 f4 Ng3 Bxg3 hxg3 Be2 Nc5 Qe3 Qb6 f5 0-0 fxe6 Nxe6 Nf5 Qxe3 Nxe3 g6 Ned5 Bh4 a4 bxa4 Nxa4 Kg7;

Stockfish:
rnbqkb1r/1p3ppp/p2ppn2/8/3NP3/2N1B3/PPP2PPP/R2QKB1R w KQkq -
  acd 39/60; acs 3972 ; acn 25083835002; ce 8 ; bm a3; pv a3 Be7 f3 0-0 Qd2 d5 e5 Nfd7 f4 Nc6 Bd3 Nc5 Be2 Qc7 Bf3 Bd7 0-0 Rfc8 Qf2 Nxd4 Bxd4 Na4 Nxa4 Bxa4 Rfc1 Qd7 Bb6 Bd8 Be3 Be7 b3 Bc6 Bb6 Bd8 Bd4 Be7 Rd1 b5 g3 a5 h3 a4 b4 h6;
rnbqkb1r/1p3ppp/p2ppn2/8/3NP3/2N1BP2/PPP3PP/R2QKB1R b KQkq -
  acd 42/60; acs 4453 ; acn 28969045767; ce 0 ; bm b5; pv b5 Qd2 Nbd7 0-0-0 Bb7 Kb1 Rc8 g4 Ne5 Rg1 Nfd7 Qe1 Qc7 a3 Nb6 f4 Nec4 Bxc4 Nxc4 Rd3 g6 Qf2 Bg7 f5 Nxe3 f6 Bh6 Ndxb5 axb5 Nxb5 Qxc2+ Qxc2 Rxc2 Nxd6+ Kd7 Nxf7+ Kc7 Nxh6 Bxe4 Rxe3 Rg2+ Rxe4 Rxg1+ Kc2 Rg2+ Kc3 Rxh2 g5 Rb8 Rxe6 Rhxb2 Kd4 R2b5 Re7+ Kc6 Re6+ Kd7;
rnbqkb1r/1p3ppp/p2ppn2/8/3NP3/P1N1B3/1PP2PPP/R2QKB1R b KQkq -
  acd 40/53; acs 2241 ; acn 13928765178; ce -14 ; bm Be7; pv Be7 f3 0-0 Qd2 d5 e5 Nfd7 f4 Nc6 Bd3 Nc5 Be2 Qc7 Bf3 Nd7 0-0 Nxd4 Bxd4 b5 Qe3 Rb8 Rfc1 Bb7 Bg4 Nc5 Nd1 h6 Nf2 Rfc8 Be2 Ne4 Nd3 Bc6 Bf3 a5 c3 Rd8 Qe2 Bb7 g3 Rbc8 Qc2 Nc5;
rnbqkb1r/5ppp/p2ppn2/1p6/3NP3/P1N1BP2/1PP3PP/R2QKB1R b KQkq -
  acd 42/60; acs 5390 ; acn 35390876966; ce 0 ; bm h5; pv h5 Qd2 Nbd7 0-0-0 Bb7 Kb1 Rc8 Be2 Be7 Bg5 0-0 h4 Re8 Rhe1 Nc5 Qe3 Qa5 Na2 Qc7 Nc3 Ncd7 g4 hxg4 fxg4 Qa5 Nb3 Qc7 Nd4;
Parent - - By siah (***) Date 2017-02-15 12:05 Edited 2017-02-15 12:10
Would you please tell me what does ac, acs and ce means please?
Parent - - By user923005 (****) [us] Date 2017-02-15 19:25
These terms are defined by the PGN standard:
https://opensource.apple.com/source/Chess/Chess-109.0.3/Documentation/PGN-Standard.txt
In particular, the EPD opcodes are as follows:

16.2.5: Opcode list

The opcodes are listed here in ASCII order of their mnemonics.  Suggestions for
new opcodes should be sent to the PGN standard coordinator listed near the
start of this document.

16.2.5.1: Opcode "acn": analysis count: nodes

The opcode "acn" takes a single non-negative integer operand.  It is used to
represent the number of nodes examined in an analysis.  Note that the value may
be quite large for some extended searches and so use of (at least) a long (four
byte) representation is suggested.

16.2.5.2: Opcode "acs": analysis count: seconds

The opcode "acs" takes a single non-negative integer operand.  It is used to
represent the number of seconds used for an analysis.  Note that the value may
be quite large for some extended searches and so use of (at least) a long (four
byte) representation is suggested.

16.2.5.3: Opcode "am": avoid move(s)

The opcode "am" indicates a set of zero or more moves, all immediately playable
from the current position, that are to be avoided in the opinion of the EPD
writer.  Each operand is a SAN move; they appear in ASCII order.

16.2.5.4: Opcode "bm": best move(s)

The opcode "bm" indicates a set of zero or more moves, all immediately playable
from the current position, that are judged to the best available by the EPD
writer.  Each operand is a SAN move; they appear in ASCII order.

16.2.5.5: Opcode "c0": comment (primary, also "c1" though "c9")

The opcode "c0" (lower case letter "c", digit character zero) indicates a top
level comment that applies to the given position.  It is the first of ten
ranked comments, each of which has a mnemonic formed from the lower case letter
"c" followed by a single decimal digit.  Each of these opcodes takes either a
single string operand or no operand at all.

This ten member comment family of opcodes is intended for use as descriptive
commentary for a complete game or game fragment.  The usual processing of these
opcodes are as follows:

1) At the beginning of a game (or game fragment), a move sequence scanning
program initializes each element of its set of ten comment string registers to
be null.

2) As the EPD record for each position in the game is processed, the comment
operations are interpreted from left to right.  (Actually, all operations in n
EPD record are interpreted from left to right.)  Because operations appear in
ASCII order according to their opcode mnemonics, opcode "c0" (if present) will
be handled prior to all other opcodes, then opcode "c1" (if present), and so
forth until opcode "c9" (if present).

3) The processing of opcode "cN" (0 <= N <= 9) involves two steps.  First, all
comment string registers with an index equal to or greater than N are set to
null.  (This is the set "cN" though "c9".)  Second, and only if a string
operand is present, the value of the corresponding comment string register is
set equal to the string operand.

16.2.5.6: Opcode "ce": centipawn evaluation

The opcode "ce" indicates the evaluation of the indicated position in centipawn
units.  It takes a single operand, an optionally signed integer that gives an
evaluation of the position from the viewpoint of the active player; i.e., the
player with the move.  Positive values indicate a position favorable to the
moving player while negative values indicate a position favorable to the
passive player; i.e., the player without the move.  A centipawn evaluation
value close to zero indicates a neutral positional evaluation.

Values are restricted to integers that are equal to or greater than -32767 and
are less than or equal to 32766.

A value greater than 32000 indicates the availability of a forced mate to the
active player.  The number of plies until mate is given by subtracting the
evaluation from the value 32767.  Thus, a winning mate in N fullmoves is a mate
in ((2 * N) - 1) halfmoves (or ply) and has a corresponding centipawn
evaluation of (32767 - ((2 * N) - 1)).  For example, a mate on the move (mate
in one) has a centipawn evaluation of 32766 while a mate in five has a
centipawn evaluation of 32758.

A value less than -32000 indicates the availability of a forced mate to the
passive player.  The number of plies until mate is given by subtracting the
evaluation from the value -32767 and then negating the result.  Thus, a losing
mate in N fullmoves is a mate in (2 * N) halfmoves (or ply) and has a
corresponding centipawn evaluation of (-32767 + (2 * N)).  For example, a mate
after the move (losing mate in one) has a centipawn evaluation of -32765 while
a losing mate in five has a centipawn evaluation of -32757.

A value of -32767 indicates an illegal position.  A stalemate position has a
centipawn evaluation of zero as does a position drawn due to insufficient
mating material.  Any other position known to be a certain forced draw also has
a centipawn evaluation of zero.

16.2.5.7: Opcode "dm": direct mate fullmove count

The "dm" opcode is used to indicate the number of fullmoves until checkmate is
to be delivered by the active color for the indicated position.  It always
takes a single operand which is a positive integer giving the fullmove count.
For example, a position known to be a "mate in three" would have an operation
of "dm 3;" to indicate this.

This opcode is intended for use with problem sets composed of positions
requiring direct mate answers as solutions.

16.2.5.8: Opcode "draw_accept": accept a draw offer

The opcode "draw_accept" is used to indicate that a draw offer made after the
move that lead to the indicated position is accepted by the active player.
This opcode takes no operands.

16.2.5.9: Opcode "draw_claim": claim a draw

The opcode "draw_claim" is used to indicate claim by the active player that a
draw exists.  The draw is claimed because of a third time repetition or because
of the fifty move rule or because of insufficient mating material.  A supplied
move (see the opcode "sm") is also required to appear as part of the same EPD
record.  The draw_claim opcode takes no operands.

16.2.5.10: Opcode "draw_offer": offer a draw

The opcode "draw_offer" is used to indicate that a draw is offered by the
active player.  A supplied move (see the opcode "sm") is also required to
appear as part of the same EPD record; this move is considered played from the
indicated position.  The draw_offer opcode takes no operands.

16.2.5.11: Opcode "draw_reject": reject a draw offer

The opcode "draw_reject" is used to indicate that a draw offer made after the
move that lead to the indicated position is rejected by the active player.
This opcode takes no operands.

16.2.5.12: Opcode "eco": _Encyclopedia of Chess Openings_ opening code

The opcode "eco" is used to associate an opening designation from the
_Encyclopedia of Chess Openings_ taxonomy with the indicated position.  The
opcode takes either a single string operand (the ECO opening name) or no
operand at all.  If an operand is present, its value is associated with an
"ECO" string register of the scanning program.  If there is no operand, the ECO
string register of the scanning program is set to null.

The usage is similar to that of the "ECO" tag pair of the PGN standard.

16.2.5.13: Opcode "fmvn": fullmove number

The opcode "fmvn" represents the fullmove n umber associated with the position.
It always takes a single operand that is the positive integer value of the move
number.

This opcode is used to explicitly represent the fullmove number in EPD that is
present by default in FEN as the sixth field.  Fullmove number information is
usually omitted from EPD because it does not affect move generation (commonly
needed for EPD-using tasks) but it does affect game notation (commonly needed
for FEN-using tasks).  Because of the desire for space optimization for large
EPD files, fullmove numbers were dropped from EPD's parent FEN.  The halfmove
clock information was similarly dropped.

16.2.5.14: Opcode "hmvc": halfmove clock

The opcode "hmvc" represents the halfmove clock associated with the position.
The halfmove clock of a position is equal to the number of plies since the last
pawn move or capture.  This information is used to implement the fifty move
draw rule.  It always takes a single operand that is the non-negative integer
value of the halfmove clock.

This opcode is used to explicitly represent the halfmove clock in EPD that is
present by default in FEN as the fifth field.  Halfmove clock information is
usually omitted from EPD because it does not affect move generation (commonly
needed for EPD-using tasks) but it does affect game termination issues
(commonly needed for FEN-using tasks).  Because of the desire for space
optimization for large EPD files, halfmove clock values were dropped from EPD's
parent FEN.  The fullmove number information was similarly dropped.

16.2.5.15: Opcode "id": position identification

The opcode "id" is used to provide a simple identifying label for the indicated
position.  It takes a single string operand.

This opcode is intended for use with test suites used for measuring
chessplaying program strength.  An example "id" operand for the seven hundred
fifty seventh position of the one thousand one problems in Reinfeld's _1001
Winning Chess Sacrifices and Combinations_ would be "WCSAC.0757" while the
fifteenth position in the twenty four problem Bratko-Kopec test suite would
have an "id" operand of "BK.15".

16.2.5.16: Opcode "nic": _New In Chess_ opening code

The opcode "nic" is used to associate an opening designation from the _New In
Chess_ taxonomy with the indicated position.  The opcode takes either a single
string operand (the NIC opening name) or no operand at all.  If an operand is
present, its value is associated with an "NIC" string register of the scanning
program.  If there is no operand, the NIC string register of the scanning
program is set to null.

The usage is similar to that of the "NIC" tag pair of the PGN standard.

16.2.5.17: Opcode "noop": no operation

The "noop" opcode is used to indicate no operation.  It takes zero or more
operands, each of which may be of any type.  The operation involves no
processing.  It is intended for use by developers for program testing purposes.

16.2.5.18: Opcode "pm": predicted move

The "pm" opcode is used to provide a single predicted move for the indicated
position.  It has exactly one operand, a move playable from the position.  This
move is judged by the EPD writer to represent the best move available to the
active player.

If a non-empty "pv" (predicted variation) line of play is also present in the
same EPD record, the first move of the predicted variation is the same as the
predicted move.

The "pm" opcode is intended for use as a general "display hint" mechanism.

16.2.5.19: Opcode "pv": predicted variation

The "pv" opcode is used to provide a predicted variation for the indicated
position.  It has zero or more operands which represent a sequence of moves
playable from the position.  This sequence is judged by the EPD writer to
represent the best play available.

If a "pm" (predicted move) operation is also present in the same EPD record,
the predicted move is the same as the first move of the predicted variation.

16.2.5.20: Opcode "rc": repetition count

The "rc" opcode is used to indicate the number of occurrences of the indicated
position.  It takes a single, positive integer operand.  Any position,
including the initial starting position, is considered to have an "rc" value of
at least one.  A value of three indicates a candidate for a draw claim by the
position repetition rule.

16.2.5.21: Opcode "resign": game resignation

The opcode "resign" is used to indicate that the active player has resigned the
game.  This opcode takes no operands.

16.2.5.22: Opcode "sm": supplied move

The "sm" opcode is used to provide a single supplied move for the indicated
position.  It has exactly one operand, a move playable from the position.  This
move is the move to be played from the position.

The "sm" opcode is intended for use to communicate the most recent played move
in an active game.  It is used to communicate moves between programs in
automatic play via a network.  This includes correspondence play using e-mail
and also programs acting as network front ends to human players.

16.2.5.23: Opcode "tcgs": telecommunication: game selector

The "tcgs" opcode is one of the telecommunication family of opcodes used for
games conducted via e-mail and similar means.  This opcode takes a single
operand that is a positive integer.  It is used to select among various games
in progress between the same sender and receiver.

16.2.5.24: Opcode "tcri": telecommunication: receiver identification

The "tcri" opcode is one of the telecommunication family of opcodes used for
games conducted via e-mail and similar means.  This opcode takes two order
dependent string operands.  The first operand is the e-mail address of the
receiver of the EPD record.  The second operand is the name of the player
(program or human) at the address who is the actual receiver of the EPD record.

16.2.5.25: Opcode "tcsi": telecommunication: sender identification

The "tcsi" opcode is one of the telecommunication family of opcodes used for
games conducted via e-mail and similar means.  This opcode takes two order
dependent string operands.  The first operand is the e-mail address of the
sender of the EPD record.  The second operand is the name of the player
(program or human) at the address who is the actual sender of the EPD record.

16.2.5.26: Opcode "v0": variation name (primary, also "v1" though "v9")

The opcode "v0" (lower case letter "v", digit character zero) indicates a top
level variation name that applies to the given position.  It is the first of
ten ranked variation names, each of which has a mnemonic formed from the lower
case letter "v" followed by a single decimal digit.  Each of these opcodes
takes either a single string operand or no operand at all.

This ten member variation name family of opcodes is intended for use as
traditional variation names for a complete game or game fragment.  The usual
processing of these opcodes are as follows:

1) At the beginning of a game (or game fragment), a move sequence scanning
program initializes each element of its set of ten variation name string
registers to be null.

2) As the EPD record for each position in the game is processed, the variation
name operations are interpreted from left to right.  (Actually, all operations
in n EPD record are interpreted from left to right.)  Because operations appear
in ASCII order according to their opcode mnemonics, opcode "v0" (if present)
will be handled prior to all other opcodes, then opcode "v1" (if present), and
so forth until opcode "v9" (if present).

3) The processing of opcode "vN" (0 <= N <= 9) involves two steps.  First, all
variation name string registers with an index equal to or greater than N are
set to null.  (This is the set "vN" though "v9".)  Second, and only if a string
operand is present, the value of the corresponding variation name string
register is set equal to the string operand.
Parent - By siah (***) Date 2017-02-15 22:03 Edited 2017-02-15 22:07
Who rememberd Fritz 5?
Please tell me unsolved algorithmic parts!
Parent - - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-11 09:22 Edited 2017-02-11 09:26
summary of current stockfish wisdom about
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sicilian_Defence,_Scheveningen_Variation#English_Attack:_6.Be3
(usually reached via 5...a6 and 6...e6)

6.Be3 a6 7.f3 b5 8.g4 h6 9.Qd2 b4 = 0.00d44-d51
6.Be3 a6 7.f3 b5 8.g4 h6 9.a3 Bb7 10.Qd2 d5 = 0.00d46-47
6.f3 e6 7.a3 b5 = 0.00d48 (h4,Qc7,Bg5)
6.Be3 a6 7.a3 Be7 8.Qe2 = +0.19 d51
6.Be3 a6 7.a3 b5 8.g4 = +0.26d48
6.Be3 a6 7.Be2 =0.12d48 (Be7,f4)

other engines :



position after 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6
evals at depths 21,22,... multipv=4  (0 : not among top 4 or eval=0)

stockfish 8
-0, 0,13,18,10, 9,10,14,13,11,14,11,12, 7,18,14,31,20,14,11,??,14,15,19,10, 8, 5,12,?? , f1e2
23,22,15,18,19,12,20,17, 6,23,14,14,18,19,16,17,18,18,11,13,??,18,12,18,23,24,30,23,23 , a2a3
-0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 6, 0, 0, 0, 0, 9,14, 5, 5, 7, 4,10, 7,??, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,?? , a2a4
62,23,23,18,15,13,13,14,22,34,22, 8,10, 0, 0, 0, 6, 0,14, 0,??, 0, 0, 0, 0,??,11, 0,?? , d1f3
34,19,11, 9, 3,16, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,??, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,10,?? , f2f3
30,26, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,??, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,?? , g2g3
-0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 6,??, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,22,?? , d1d2
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49

houdini 5
-0,36, 8,21,18,33,33,37,28,26,35,40,28,26,50,30,33,a2a3
11,17,11,15,23, 5,10,20,20,20,30,23,34,32,26,20,31,f1e2
-0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,23, 9,18,21,d1d2
-0, 0, 0,18,--, 0,15, 0,17,25,25,15, 0,10, 6, 0, 8,f2f3
-0, 0,15, 6, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,a2a4
-0,18, 6,18,10, 0,13, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,d1f3
-------------------------------------------------------
21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37

komodo 10.2
16,23,19,13,13,19,14,14,22,21,22,18,16,22,24,27,f1e2
-0, 0,14, 0,13,15,16,13,12,15,15, 8,18,11,14,16,d1f3
-0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,17,17, 0, 0,17,15,22,a2a3
12,13,13,14,13,11, 0, 0, 8, 0,10,14,12,11, 0, 0,f1d3
-0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,12,10, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,12, 0,d1d2
11,11, 9,11, 8,11, 0, 0, 0,11, 0,13,12, 0, 0, 0,a2a4
-0, 4, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,f2f4
+7, 0, 0,10, 0, 0,11,13, 9, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 7,f2f3
----------------------------------------------------
21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36

andscacs 0.8832n r1
-0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,25,26,25,26,21,26,26,22,21,f1e2
-0, 0, 0,26,27,24,19,31,24,19,16,12,22,19,15,16,a2a4
-0,27,26,34,26,31,23, 9,29,26,35,35,14,15,14,22,f2f3
-0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 9, 4,h2h4
-0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 1, 1, 0,f1c4
36,26,29,26,30,26,28, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,a2a3
12, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,h1g1
40,37,45,31,26,27,25,30,40,25,30, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,d1f3
30,33,33,17, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,d1d2
33,24, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,13, 5, 0, 0, 6,-1, 0, 0, 0,f1d3
----------------------------------------------------
21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36

critter v1.6a
17,18,18,19,16,f1d3
14,15, 9,13, 0,d1f3
14,14, 9, 8, 0,d1d2
-0, 0,12,12, 0,f1e2
14,15, 8, 0, 0,a2a4
-0, 0, 0,13, 9,a2a3
-------------------
21 22 23 24 25

Parent - - By siah (***) Date 2017-02-14 15:03
I was wondering iF you would mind talking about this numbers!?!
Parent - - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-14 17:04
me ? something unclear ? evals in centipawns for the moves on the right of the lines.
Depth is specified in the bottom line

only the final evals, fail-high , fail-low ignored. If someone sends/uploads more logs,
I can extract the corresponding table from it
Parent - - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-15 07:05 Edited 2017-02-15 07:47
under windows cmd.exe command line I use this batch file , named 7a3a.bat:
-----------------------------------
echo off
echo uci
echo setoption name OwnBook value false
echo setoption name Contempt value 0
echo setoption name Hash value 512
echo setoption name MultiPV value 4
echo position startpos moves e2e4 c7c5 g1f3 d7d6 d2d4 c5d4 f3d4 g8f6 b1c3 a7a6 c1e3 e7e6
echo go infinite
set /P hit=
echo quit
--------------------------------

then I run 7a3a.bat | engine.exe > c:\ll

where c: is not the drive, where 7a3a.bat and engine.exe are on,
so to allow better caching and avoid frequent loud drive-head movements.

Then I filter c:\ll using ucioutk.exe c:\ll > table.txt to produce these tables,
which I consider more informative than just the one eval.
You can download ucioutk.exe at http://magictour.free.fr/ucioutk.exe ,
it is compiled for 32bit with old gcc3.2 , I don't know whether it runs on 64-bit systems.
The short and simple source-code is attached to the executable, maybe someone can
compile it and upload a 64-bit executable for modern computers.

=================================
the first depth that 7.a3 is among the top 4 moves for at least 5 consecutive depths

depth 15 for Stockfish 8
depth 13 for Houdini 5
depth 34? for Komodo 10.2
depth 14 for Andscacs 0.8832n r1  (d14-27
Fruit reloaded 2.1  first has 7.a3 among the top 4 moves at depth 18
Naum
Texel
iCe
Parent - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-02-23 08:52 Edited 2017-02-23 10:05
at depth 50 asmfish dec7 insists that 8.h4 is best after
1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6
6.Be3 e6 7.Be2 Be7 .
Another surprising opening move that is not in the books,
rarely played, I found no game with it at
CCRL,Noomen,FCP, FS-CD (~3M games)
The pv continues 8...e5 9.Nf5 Bxf5 10.exf5 d5
11.Bg5 d4 12.Bxf6 Bxf6 13.Ne4 with eval=+0.19
update: +0.17d51

in another run with multipv=4 asmfish has 7.a3(Be7,f3[better:Qe2]) with eval +0.12
and 7.Be2(NBe7,f4,00,g4) with eval +0.10  (7.Qf3 and 7.a4 with 0.00)

stockfish 3 already favoured 7.a3 at some depths -
it didn't become popular yet

----------------------------------------
now at depth 52, multipv=1, asmfish-2017-01-22 gives 7.a3 as best with
eval=+0.23 and pv h6,h4,Be7,Be2,e5,Nb3
(This is hardly better than 7.Be2,Be7,h4,e5,Nb3 ?!)
------------------------------------
Parent - - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-07-09 18:39 Edited 2017-07-09 19:18
interesting rook sacrifice in the 7.a3 variation :


1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6 7.a3 b5 8.g4 d5 9.exd5 Bb7 10.dxe6


[9...Nxd5,Nxd5,Qxd5,Rg1,Qd7,Bg2,Bb7,Nxe6]

after
1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.Be3 e6 7.a3 b5 8.g4 d5 9.exd5 Bb7
10.dxe6 Bxh1 11.g5 Nd5 12.Qg4 Ra7 13.Nxd5 Bxd5 14.O-O-O Bc5 15.exf7+ Rxf7
16.Nf5 Bxe3+ 17.Nxe3 O-O 18.Nxd5
Stockfish gives + 0.61d50

1n1q1rk1/5rpp/p7/1p1N2P1/6Q1/P7/1PP2P1P/2KR1B2 b - -
Parent - - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-08-19 05:45 Edited 2017-08-19 05:47
another nice piece-sacrifice, Computer-"trap" in the 7.a3 variation:
1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6
6.Be3 e6 7.a3 ! b5 8.g4 Bb7 9.Bg2 Nc6 10.g5 Nd7
11.f4 h6 12.Nxe6 =87d44
my asmfish "sees" it at depth 37
Parent - - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-09-19 16:02 Edited 2017-09-19 16:28
3 games asmFish - Komodo , first 20 moves at TCEC-like TC


[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2017.09.17"]
[Round "1"]
[White "asmFishL_2017-08-25_popcnt"]
[Black "Komodo 10.2 64-bit"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B80"]
[Opening "Sicilian"]
[PlyCount "42"]
[Termination "adjudication"]
[TimeControl "40/30000+60"]
[Variation "Scheveningen Variation"]

1. e4 {book} c5 {book} 2. Nf3 {book} d6 {book} 3. d4 {book} cxd4 {book}
4. Nxd4 {book} Nf6 {book} 5. Nc3 {book} e6 {book} 6. Be3 {book} a6 {book}
7. a3 {book} b5 {book} 8. g4 {book} Bb7 {-0.23/34 773s} 9. Bg2 {+0.15/39 2520s}
Nc6 {-0.21/36 2571s} 10. Nxc6 {+0.25/40 1398s} Bxc6 {-0.18/34 407s}
11. g5 {+0.28/39 853s} Nd7 {-0.16/33 476s} 12. h4 {+0.22/35 114s}
Be7 {-0.20/33 751s} 13. f4 {0.00/39 1725s} a5 {-0.22/33 736s}
14. Ne2 {0.00/39 721s} Nc5 {-0.17/34 633s} 15. Ng3 {+0.08/41 1789s}
Qc7 {-0.17/33 502s} 16. Qg4 {+0.28/39 5816s} g6 {-0.20/35 1397s}
17. Rd1 {+0.15/35 922s} Na4 {0.00/33 991s} 18. b3 {+0.55/32 393s}
Nc3 {-0.29/31 521s} 19. Rd3 {+0.68/32 109s} b4 {-0.23/34 2453s}
20. Bd4 {+0.81/32 327s} e5 {-0.21/33 448s} 21. Bxc3 {+0.70/37 1037s}
Bb5 {-0.09/33 374s, Draw by adjudication} 1/2-1/2




[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2017.09.18"]
[Round "1"]
[White "asmFishL_2017-08-25_popcnt"]
[Black "Komodo 10.2 64-bit"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B80"]
[Opening "Sicilian"]
[PlyCount "42"]
[Termination "adjudication"]
[TimeControl "40/30000+60"]
[Variation "Scheveningen Variation"]

1. e4 {book} c5 {book} 2. Nf3 {book} d6 {book} 3. d4 {book} cxd4 {book}
4. Nxd4 {book} Nf6 {book} 5. Nc3 {book} e6 {book} 6. Be3 {book} a6 {book}
7. a3 {book} b5 {book} 8. g4 {book} h6 {-0.26/37 2494s} 9. Bg2 {+0.49/38 1465s}
Bb7 {-0.29/37 1453s} 10. h4 {+0.51/39 780s} Nc6 {-0.25/34 368s}
11. Qe2 {+0.65/39 917s} Ne5 {-0.30/36 2019s} 12. g5 {+0.59/42 900s}
hxg5 {-0.27/35 360s} 13. hxg5 {+0.47/40 139s} Rxh1+ {-0.32/34 285s}
14. Bxh1 {+0.63/41 416s} Nfd7 {-0.37/36 890s} 15. f4 {+0.56/39 147s}
Nc4 {-0.38/35 444s} 16. O-O-O {+0.45/41 1909s} g6 {-0.34/35 648s}
17. f5 {+0.82/40 1269s} Qe7 {-0.30/34 349s} 18. f6 {+0.67/36 130s}
Qd8 {-0.19/35 443s} 19. Bf2 {+0.67/41 1125s} Rc8 {-0.12/36 850s}
20. e5 {+1.07/40 469s} Bxh1 {-0.39/37 695s} 21. exd6 {+1.33/38 157s}
Nde5 {-0.48/37 599s, Draw by adjudication} 1/2-1/2





[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2017.09.19"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Komodo 10.2 64-bit"]
[Black "asmFishL_2017-08-25_popcnt"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B80"]
[Opening "Sicilian"]
[PlyCount "40"]
[Termination "adjudication"]
[TimeControl "40/30000+60"]
[Variation "Scheveningen Variation"]

1. e4 {book} c5 {book} 2. Nf3 {book} d6 {book} 3. d4 {book} cxd4 {book}
4. Nxd4 {book} Nf6 {book} 5. Nc3 {book} e6 {book} 6. Be3 {book} a6 {book}
7. a3 {book} b5 {book} 8. g4 {book} Bb7 {-0.11/39 1179s} 9. Bg2 {+0.25/35 916s}
Nc6 {-0.18/38 2250s} 10. g5 {+0.27/35 1729s} Nd7 {-0.16/36 639s}
11. f4 {+0.25/35 1111s} Be7 {-0.22/39 3164s} 12. Nxc6 {+0.33/34 1160s}
Bxc6 {-0.04/34 695s} 13. O-O {+0.23/37 2761s} e5 {0.00/41 587s}
14. Qh5 {+0.28/36 954s} exf4 {0.00/47 521s} 15. Bxf4 {+0.20/36 599s}
O-O {0.00/46 562s} 16. Rad1 {+0.12/37 856s} Qb6+ {0.00/43 184s}
17. Kh1 {+0.13/34 255s} Ne5 {0.00/47 848s} 18. Nd5 {+0.14/37 1505s}
Bxd5 {0.00/48 164s} 19. Rxd5 {+0.11/39 2391s} Qc6 {0.00/50 858s}
20. Qd1 {+0.18/36 1071s} Rae8 {0.00/48 3916s, Draw by adjudication} 1/2-1/2



#!/bin/sh
./cutechess-cli
  -engine cmd=q-Aug25 proto=uci option.Threads=8 option.Hash=1024
  -engine cmd=komot2 proto=uci option.Threads=8 option.Contempt=0 option.Hash=1024
  -each tc=40/30000+60 -rounds 1 -pgnout tourzv.pgn -openings file=7b5g4.pgn format=pgn
  -repeat -draw movenumber=20 movecount=1 score=999999


[    asmFish        -     Komodo]

01.   e4 {book}             c5 {book}
02.  Nf3 {book}             d6 {book}
03.   d4 {book}           cxd4 {book}
04. Nxd4 {book}            Nf6 {book}
05.  Nc3 {book}             e6 {book}
06.  Be3 {book}             a6 {book}
07.   a3 {book}             b5 {book}
08.   g4 {book}            Bb7 {-0.23/34  773s}       00000 00773
09.  Bg2 {+0.15/39 2520s}  Nc6 {-0.21/36 2571s}       02520 03344
10. Nxc6 {+0.25/40 1398s} Bxc6 {-0.18/34  407s}       03918 03751
11.   g5 {+0.28/39  853s}  Nd7 {-0.16/33  476s}       04771 04227
12.   h4 {+0.22/35  114s}  Be7 {-0.20/33  751s}       04885 04987
13.   f4 {+0.00/39 1725s}   a5 {-0.22/33  736s}       06610 05714
14.  Ne2 {+0.00/39  721s}  Nc5 {-0.17/34  633s}       07331 06347
15.  Ng3 {+0.08/41 1789s}  Qc7 {-0.17/33  502s}       09120 06849
16.  Qg4 {+0.28/39 5816s}   g6 {-0.20/35 1397s}       14936 08246
17.  Rd1 {+0.15/35  922s}  Na4 {+0.00/33  991s}       15858 09237
18.   b3 {+0.55/32  393s}  Nc3 {-0.29/31  521s}       16251 09758
19.  Rd3 {+0.68/32  109s}   b4 {-0.23/34 2453s}       16360 12211
20.  Bd4 {+0.81/32  327s}   e5 {-0.21/33  448s}       16687 12659
21. Bxc3 {+0.70/37 1037s}  Bb5 {-0.09/33  374s}       17724 13033



#!/bin/sh
./cutechess-cli
  -engine cmd=q-Aug25 proto=uci option.Threads=8 option.Hash=1024
  -engine cmd=komot2 proto=uci option.Threads=8 option.Contempt=0 option.Hash=1024
  -each tc=40/30000+60 -rounds 1 -pgnout tourzv.pgn -openings file=7b5g4.pgn format=pgn
  -repeat -draw movenumber=20 movecount=1 score=999999



    asmFish        -      Komodo
01.   e4 {book}              c5 {book}
02.  Nf3 {book}              d6 {book}
03.   d4 {book}            cxd4 {book}
04. Nxd4 {book}             Nf6 {book}
05.  Nc3 {book}              e6 {book}
06.  Be3 {book}              a6 {book}
07.   a3 {book}              b5 {book}
08.   g4 {book}              h6 {-0.26/37 2494s}
09.  Bg2 {+0.49/38 1465s}   Bb7 {-0.29/37 1453s}
10.   h4 {+0.51/39  780s}   Nc6 {-0.25/34  368s}
11.  Qe2 {+0.65/39  917s}   Ne5 {-0.30/36 2019s}
12.   g5 {+0.59/42  900s}  hxg5 {-0.27/35  360s}
13. hxg5 {+0.47/40  139s}  Rxh1+{-0.32/34  285s}
14. Bxh1 {+0.63/41  416s}  Nfd7 {-0.37/36  890s}
15.   f4 {+0.56/39  147s}   Nc4 {-0.38/35  444s}
16.O-O-O {+0.45/41 1909s}    g6 {-0.34/35  648s}
17.   f5 {+0.82/40 1269s}   Qe7 {-0.30/34  349s}
18.   f6 {+0.67/36  130s}   Qd8 {-0.19/35  443s}
19.  Bf2 {+0.67/41 1125s}   Rc8 {-0.12/36  850s}
20.   e5 {+1.07/40  469s}  Bxh1 {-0.39/37  695s}
21. exd6 {+1.33/38  157s}  Nde5 {-0.48/37  599s}





    Komodo         -      asmFish
01.   e4 {book}              c5 {book}
02.  Nf3 {book}              d6 {book}
03.   d4 {book}            cxd4 {book}
04. Nxd4 {book}             Nf6 {book}
05.  Nc3 {book}              e6 {book}
06.  Be3 {book}              a6 {book}
07.   a3 {book}              b5 {book}
08.   g4 {book}             Bb7 {-0.11/39 1179s}
09.  Bg2 {+0.25/35  916s}   Nc6 {-0.18/38 2250s}
10.   g5 {+0.27/35 1729s}   Nd7 {-0.16/36  639s}
11.   f4 {+0.25/35 1111s}   Be7 {-0.22/39 3164s}
12. Nxc6 {+0.33/34 1160s}  Bxc6 {-0.04/34  695s}
13.  O-O {+0.23/37 2761s}    e5 {+0.00/41  587s}
14.  Qh5 {+0.28/36  954s}  exf4 {+0.00/47  521s}
15. Bxf4 {+0.20/36  599s}   O-O {+0.00/46  562s}
16. Rad1 {+0.12/37  856s}   Qb6+{+0.00/43  184s}
17.  Kh1 {+0.13/34  255s}   Ne5 {+0.00/47  848s}
18.  Nd5 {+0.14/37 1505s}  Bxd5 {+0.00/48  164s}
19. Rxd5 {+0.11/39 2391s}   Qc6 {+0.00/50  858s}
20.  Qd1 {+0.18/36 1071s}  Rae8 {+0.00/48 3916s}

Parent - - By gsgs (**) [de] Date 2017-12-31 02:29 Edited 2017-12-31 02:47
two 20-move-games asmFish vs. Houdini with 7.a3 b5 8.g4 , TCEC-like TC ,
in game 2 asmFish went into the asmFish-trap (8...e5?) itself !
Slightly different move order. Houdini played 11.h3 instead of 11.h4 (~+0.70d60),
which leaded to a QB4-QN4 ending after only 24 moves (~+0.20)
Game one went +0.85/+0.60 in favour of asmFish.
here the 2 games attached to the 10 games with Komodo:
http://magictour.free.fr/7b5g4.pgn

also in the fish pond https://lantonov.github.io/asmFish/home.html
under collection , encyclopedia...

-----------------------------

I finally got Houdini working under Arch-Linux on the Ryzen 1700x with wine .
The created Houdini executable was in the hidden directory .wine, not searchable,
which had confused me. Being new to Linux, it was also a pain to install wine
in Arch with editing the non-writable pacman.conf etc.
passwords, restrictions, superuser,errors, missing packages,updates,...
The Ryzen crashes every couple of hours on other
Linux like Knoppix,Ubuntu,Mint
---------------------------------------
maybe I'll play a asmfish-komodo-houdini opening-superfinal with 20-move games ... (1game=12h)
--------------------------------------
Parent - By bob (Gold) [us] Date 2017-12-31 04:16
Are you overclocking?  If Linux is crashing frequently that would NOT give me a lot of confidence in any test results.  You might have pushed it too far.
Up Topic The Rybka Lounge / Computer Chess / Sicilian Najdorf,Scheveningen,Kan with 6.Be3 and 7.a3

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