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Up Topic The Rybka Lounge / Correspondence Chess / Relay Chess: H1N1 Junkies Vs. NATIONAL12 & Vempele 1/2-1/2
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Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-09 10:10
fine by me,but we are still waiting for Vytrons sixth move in game 2
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-09 10:15
Yes, so Vempele please do not make your move here until the other game is caught up. You have no clock at all on this game and if we all agree to kill the clock and move it also to an honor system then all you need to do is wait for these moves at Board #2 - Vytron(Black move #6)- Vempele(White move #7) - PortCitySlim (Black move #7) and then it will be Nat12's move at board #2 and Vempele's move here board #1.  
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2009-05-09 10:18

> Yes, so Vempele please do not make your move here until the other game is caught up.


It's NATIONAL12's turn on this board.
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-09 10:22

> It's NATIONAL12's turn on this board.


Not yet, it'll be after I move at the other board, or something like that :eek:

What's the advantage of keeping the games laced anyway? (it's not nice that I'm the only one told that I've moved at the wrong board when everyone has done that at some point too, so let me rant.)
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2009-05-09 10:30

> Not yet, it'll be after I move at the other board, or something like that


Yeah, I meant it as in "the next player to move on this board will be NATIONAL12".

> What's the advantage of keeping the games laced anyway?


I suggest we try to get (and keep) them laced after the opening. And break it whenever there are forced moves.
Parent - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-09 10:32

> I suggest we try to get (and keep) them laced after the opening. And break it whenever there are forced moves.


Agreed, I see no reason for NATIONAL12 to not capture with the queen now.
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-10 00:17

> (it's not nice that I'm the only one told that I've moved at the wrong board when everyone has done that at some point too, so let me rant.)


That was only after we decided to try and help put the moves back together, or at least I thought that is what you meant when you asked me for help. Of course, you should know that I was not getting on to you, the ! mark that I put on my statement was more meant as funny "oops" type statement and not meant to offend. It was my fault the whole thing got screwed up in the first place, but now we almost have everything back in order. I do not mind the games not being laced but we have to play without a time control if we do that, if we keep the games on a flag time control we should lace them. We are all friends and I do not think it will get out of control if we just play whenever we can without a flag, it would be easier and keep the game more fun. I do not know about the others but I am not "blood-thirsty" in this game, I do want to try and win but I am not going to lose my head over it, LOL
Parent - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-10 00:24
LOL
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-10 00:27

> I do not mind the games not being laced but we have to play without a time control if we do that, if we keep the games on a flag time control we should lace them.


No, we could just treat them as separate games (as if we were 8 different persons) with individual clocks. If someone has to move at both boards at a given time he gets 48 hours to move, that way the games remain "laced" at some different definition, but one game doesn't have to wait for the other one after forced moves.

I'm just saying my opinion, not trying to change the rules or anything, but if at some point due to forced moves I get to play at both boards, if I see it's convenient I may play at the "wrong" board again (just as everyone has done at some point), sorry.
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-10 00:33
if you could just post the forced moves line,it would no doubt help us all.
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-10 00:38
Ok, good.
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-10 00:48
if you give forced line in next 30 mins i will rethink the matter,Vempele is 2 hours ahead of me and no doubt fast asleep.
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-10 01:02
Oh, not from this move, I may do it on a future one if I see fit.
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-10 01:09
so we keep the games laced,at least for the moment.i see no forced lines.
Parent - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-10 03:05
Yes, I was not talking about this position specifically, but about the game in general, sorry for the confusion.
Parent - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-09 10:22
i play move 7 in game 2.i play the odd numbered moves here.i will not play my move in game 1 untill games are linked again.
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-09 22:46
8...Qxd7
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-10 05:43
I am going to reply to this move tonight in a few hours. After I make my move I think the games will be properly linked because it will be Vempele's move here and your move at the other board. If we keep it so that both team members have moves at the other boards then the games are linked.

BTW- Vytron, I just got a chance to go over your last move and I think I really like your choice, good job.
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-10 08:22
Phew, no more "Nb1"'s from me :smile:
Parent - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-10 08:28 Edited 2009-05-10 08:31
I find myself now in a very complicated choice. I am not sure if I can choose tonight. I might need to wait until about 20 hours after Nat12's last move.
Parent - - By Mark (****) [us] Date 2009-05-09 11:11
Seems like most of the analysis so far is just figuring out whose move it is in which game.  :)
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-09 22:55
fun though,chaos reigns.
Parent - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-09 23:05
actually if you go into any known opening books,no matter how specialised they are,you will find that in both games we are already at the known edge of GM theory.i am not talking about computer chess here.
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-10 11:35
9.h3

1. e4 g6 2. d4 d6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. f4 Nf6 5. Nf3 c5 6. Bb5+ Bd7 7.e5 Ng4 8.Bxd7+ Qxd7 9.h3

rn2k2r/pp1qppbp/3p2p1/2p1P3/3P1Pn1/2N2N1P/PPP3P1/R1BQK2R b KQkq - 0 9
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2009-05-10 11:38
9...cxd4 Ponderhit

1. e4 g6 2. d4 d6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. f4 Nf6 5. Nf3 c5 6. Bb5+ Bd7 7. e5 Ng4 8. Bxd7+ Qxd7 9. h3 cxd4

rn2k2r/pp1qppbp/3p2p1/4P3/3p1Pn1/2N2N1P/PPP3P1/R1BQK2R w KQkq - 0 9
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-10 11:48 Edited 2009-05-10 11:51
Well, I know that white can not lose this game now. I am pretty sure 9.d5 was an easier draw for black. I had a few games where a human grandmaster easily drew after d5.
Parent - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-10 12:05
yes,9.h3 was a good move.9.d5 had been played before.
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-10 22:44 Edited 2009-05-11 08:25
10.Qxd4

1. e4 g6 2. d4 d6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. f4 Nf6 5. Nf3 c5 6. Bb5+
Bd7 7. e5 Ng4 8. Bxd7+ Qxd7 9. h3 cxd4 10. Qxd4*

rn2k2r/pp1qppbp/3p2p1/4P3/3Q1Pn1/2N2N1P/PPP3P1/R1B1K2R b KQkq - 0 10
Parent - - By NATIONAL12 (Gold) [gb] Date 2009-05-11 06:57
10...Nc6
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-11 07:19
I am now waiting for Vempele's move on the other board to be able to reply here. Both games are linked now and if we keep the time control each player has 24 hours to move after the last move made by the other team. If we forget about the time control then we just move as soon as both opposing team members have moved. :)
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2009-05-11 09:17
So I have until tomorrow?

(not saying I won't move today, just that if I have to move in the next 2.5 hours I probably won't be able to find out the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth about the position)
Parent - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-11 19:42
You had 24 hours from the time of my move. It will depend whether PCS or me move the latest, then both your clocks start running at the same time.
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-12 08:31 Edited 2009-05-12 08:39
11.Qa4  :)

1. e4 g6 2. d4 d6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. f4 Nf6 5. Nf3 c5 6. Bb5+
Bd7 7. e5 Ng4 8. Bxd7+ Qxd7 9. h3 cxd4 10. Qxd4 Nc6
11.Qa4

r3k2r/pp1qppbp/2np2p1/4P3/Q4Pn1/2N2N1P/PPP3P1/R1B1K2R b KQkq - 2 11


BTW, my other thoughts were that after (11.Qd3 Nh6 12.Be3 Nf5 13.0-0-0 0-0-0 14.g4 Nxe3 15.Qxe3 Qc7 16.Ng5 dxe5 17.Nxf7 Rxd1+) then black would have a rather easy draw. I think my move gives black a much harder time if they want a draw. :)
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2009-05-12 08:37
11...Nh6

There were some neat lines after 11.Qe4.
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-12 08:41
Neat but drawn.
Parent - - By Dadi Jonsson (Silver) [is] Date 2009-05-12 09:10
What was your mainline after 11.Qe4?
Parent - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2009-05-12 09:36
Mine was 11...Nh6 12. O-O Nf5 13. Rd1 h5 14. Ng5 e6 15. g4 hxg4 16. hxg4 Qe7

14. Be3 was better but less interesting.
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-12 10:55
Well I really did not like this

+0.09 11.Qe4 Nh6 12.0-0 0-0 13.Rd1 Rad8 14.Be3 Qc8 15.g4 dxe5 16.Nxe5 Nxe5 17.fxe5 f5 18.exf6 exf6 19.Rxd8 Rxd8 20.Rd1 Rxd1+ 21.Nxd1 a6
Parent - - By Dadi Jonsson (Silver) [is] Date 2009-05-12 10:59
OK, I saw some games where White won after 12.g4, and I was wondering if it was a good move. I see that neither you nor Vempele had that move in your variation, so it's probably not such a great move.
Parent - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-12 11:31
12.g4 was not a bad looking move. Without going into deep examination because I only had 24 hours to move I was worried about a ton of exchanges being made leaving a simple endgame for black. I guess something like this might happen...

12. ... 0-0-0 13.Qc4 dxe5 14.fxe5 Qe6 15.Qb3 Qxb3 16.axb3 f5 17.exf6 exf6

2kr3r/pp4bp/2n2ppn/8/6P1/1PN2N1P/1PP5/R1B1K2R w KQ - 0 18


13.Qe2 might be better but just a quick analysis by Rybka leaves....

Rybka 3:
  19     0.00  13. ... dxe5 14.fxe5 Qe6 15.Bf4 f6 16.exf6 Qxe2+

With 24 hours I was going to play 11.Qd3 early on but then as a last minute check I decided to look at some possible endgame positions from 11.Qa4 11.Qd3 and 11.Qe4, only move that gave me a position that I thought would give me a shot at a win was 11.Qa4
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-12 10:38
Whew! It took me a while to realize why Qa4 was awesome, at first it was just confusion and bad evaluation, but eventually I got the mini-fail high. I don't see a better move, I'll play this right now.

12.Bd2

1. e4 g6 2. d4 d6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. f4 Nf6 5. Nf3 c5 6. Bb5+
Bd7 7. e5 Ng4 8. Bxd7+ Qxd7 9. h3 cxd4 10. Qxd4 Nc6 11. Qa4
Nh6 12. Bd2

r3k2r/pp1qppbp/2np2pn/4P3/Q4P2/2N2N1P/PPPB2P1/R3K2R b KQkq -
Parent - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-12 10:53 Edited 2009-05-12 11:11

> Whew!


That's what I am saying. Wow you moved fast but you played what I expected. Good Job! I do not want to say much about why I am playing the moves I am playing because I do not want to tip off the other team if I find a trap. I just play the move that I think gives us the best winning chances. I think you are capable of seeing the ideas behind my moves so if I play something that catches you off guard do not worry because I think everything works out to be at least an interesting game.
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2009-05-12 11:11
Is it before or after move 20?
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-12 11:35
I hope he does not answer that, :) With so many possible lines I am not sure if I even know what "fail high" he saw. I do know that this will be more fun for me then the alternatives. I like things more complicated even if they do not eval as well sometimes.
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2009-05-12 11:49
How is 12. g4 O-O-O 13. Bd2 Nxg4 less fun for white? :)
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-12 12:15
Huh? That is not fun, that is nuts.
Parent - - By Vempele (Silver) [fi] Date 2009-05-12 12:32
What's wrong with Bishop vs 3 pawns?
Parent - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-13 00:46
Most of the time I would rather have three pawns. Obviously the bishop is not going to win by itself.
Parent - - By Uly (Gold) [mx] Date 2009-05-12 22:16

> Is it before or after move 20?


I said mini-fail high, as in 10-20 cp (Qa4 being that better than Qe4), as easy as it came it may go away with a mini-fail low :wink:

*Vytron avoids the question.
Parent - - By Bobby C (****) Date 2009-05-13 06:49
I think it will, I am not expecting to see high scores until it is too late for black..... :)
Up Topic The Rybka Lounge / Correspondence Chess / Relay Chess: H1N1 Junkies Vs. NATIONAL12 & Vempele 1/2-1/2
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